Hello, everyone and welcome to episode twenty one of true crime all the time I might research in with me as all. Is my gibson gibbey. What is going on very mike doing good man, I appear, I can't believe, is twenty episode. I know that's crazy and there assets is, when you think about from alton coleman all the way up to twenty one and how may download,

we're gettin and how much interaction were given its blows. I know blows is both aware. I can't yet twenty one episode rural areas and the interaction. That's the part that really Now I know that the people saying that you're assess back with a K bar you know. But again I know you get a kick out of it, now most of you are familiar with Jeffrey down. We covered him in multiple episodes. What a twisted indonesia mind of a monster from iD is out with a fourth season about Jeffrey Dahmer, on mind of a monster doctor. Michelle ward takes us through the story, starting with Dahmer, his childhood and the first murder all the way through his death. The podcast features jaw dropping never before heard audio recordings from the detectives, journalists and others close to the case too floor exactly what happened and how

his killer came to be so. This sounds like a very deep dark and for me, anytime, you get never before heard audio from people very close to the case. Ahmet, listen to mind of a monster on. We'll podcast spotify or wherever you get your pockets. So we give some shouts. We got a bunch of new patriots supporters, which is awesome, love that so shot out to jennifer richard Jordan. no last name, Jordan, lemons, which we was one of our very. First supporters! Actually dead, are first home town listener episode. We love Jordan, she's been with us ass. You get she's good friend, yet been with us from the very beginning to jennifer, jordan in Jordan, the ep, Catherine clark and jeanette craig and jeanette specific for jason, okay about that sea, about again Thank you so much to everybody and proceeded as

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listen to this absurd jump over check out the tube sat killer onto crime. All the time on saw I and you re to get into this, I'm ready there was a small are night sure short clear by now, but that is Jerome Bruno's jerry, we're gonna call him. Jerry his mama named in Jerome, but I'm gonna, calling jerry right, I would love to found more but found this little clip and basically what it is its jerome Jerry Bhutto's being interviewed by a reporter and the reporter ass SAM. You know about it. murders. Basically, why did you do the things that you'd dead, which is what we're gonna get into an jerry says? that is a slow saturday night, slow saturday night last clay, be maniacal, lamb, jerome

jerry burgos was also known as what gives the less killer alaska An issue fetish layer like that when the shoe fetish slayer, which Actually, I think is more. It has more of his calling. Don't you think he? I think it's it's more descriptive of him. Yes, but again we talk about re. Every serial killer has to have a nickname. I don't know why you know what we like to give people nickname by these country, gibbey gimme. so, like we always like to do a start. Early life and jerry brood was born on January thirty, first, nineteen, thirty nine in Webster south Dakota. He was the second son, Henry and I lean in here The brother, whose name was larry now one thing,

by that I saw was it was mentioned that jerry was an accidental birth. Yes, in that and his parents, even even with the accidental birth, and I think, trying to have him bright, but when they found out that Eileen was pregnant. They really want a daughter This would kind of shape some of what jerry becomes sure someone first in watcher and then when they did have you they were happy with how you came out with, which is strange, because his dad owned up huge farm. If I remember right, so, you think you'd back in those days, you'd want as many voices you came. Nineteen thirty nine in south dakota you'd think he'd want some where farm hand as exactly right, so that that was pretty strange but like we said- and I think it was a lot of it- was his mother.

Whose very upset that she had a son and not a girl, and she was constantly belittling jerry treated abuse terms. In treating very well at all, and I think a lot of it stemmed from the fact that again she wasn't happy with how he came out. I guess I don't know if that's the right term, but. the family, would move a number of times sleep stayed in the pacific northwest and Some point early his childhood: they settling in salem organ. Jerome brutus- was borned, will woman who really wanted a girl, and we always hear about families or fathers who say really want a boy. but to imagine a mother who says I really want to go. I don't want a boy how a boy and later on this treaty, by his his first relationship with it,

his mother is very important. That he was sort of abandoned by her and simultaneously that she almost had a lot of anger towards hamper even haven't been born. There can definitely a feeling that some have a backlash. I think this one's important, because what she touches on in the fact of how somebody in let's say a man, his first interaction with a female figure who, in this cases his mother right, has a big effect sure on how this person treats women later in life. I agree and you can go back. You can look at at geen. You can look at a whole host of people tomlin, so yeah, so tami Lynn sells right,

was there a recent episode right just just another case, so one thing about jerry is and it's central. No to this whole episode. He becomes fascinated with women's high heeled shoes from a very early age very early. You know at one point he found a pair of high heeled shoes, in the yard, while he was walking any put em on me. Warm home that didn't go over well with his mom, that's a weird thing for a kid to find a junk yard and the for a boy. I would think to find a high heel pair of shoes and that's what he wanted to keep. I find it french, well yeah, so his mom scalded am nova. She beating but she was awning big time bout wherein the shoes and she went to the point of even burning them in front of him. That's watering.

Five year old rubul finds this pair women choose something had made him pick those up rather than for a dumptruck cora or a toy tracker to play with so he brings her. Per woman shoes and that any begins to wear them around the house. Shoes became taboo and her reaction to the shoes hidden understand why she was it was It was so adamant that he shouldn't have those she persuaded him emotionally, so he kept those it was really out of control the shoes and phone in his gaze. He gets this message from his mom, a very strong disapproval that this is wrong, that this is now its dirty and he's not to be doing it you're the flame of his anger, to the point where it that's probably, and he really started, feeling powerless For all and that combined with- anger and frustrate

It can lead to a path of destruction later on down the line. They started to dissociate sexual arousal without aggressiveness with a forbidden aspect of the shoes in that blossomed, into this very strong to me this fascinating because really getting in to the crux of how he starts to go down the path that he does can again we're talking very yeah, yeah right five, six years, all right. Well, what is it can a garden first grade if yeah, so at this early age, you know he's starting

to put violence and arousal together getting aroused by the violence and that's going to show up. You know in the in the cases we move along yeah so, like we said, gives we're talking first grade and he steals a pair of high heel shoes from his first grade teacher. Ok so he's got a teacher who loves to where high heels- and for some reason she kept multiple pairs in the classroom and at one point he steals one of the extra pairs. So he's fascinated enough. This nasa para, oh yeah, yeah! He wants to take them home and one of his classmates tells Ani and he's forced to confess and his

I teacher gets angry and jerry gets really embarrassed by this and storms out so again kind gone back to his mother. It's almost like the same thing he's being scolded for this fact is- and I dont even know how he five six year old- has a fetish. But maybe you know I don't know what else to call it up. I guess to be like a kid today that has a fetish that are not finished but need to watch the same show every time they come home from school. They gotta do it, they gotta do it or they have to have. They won't eat a hotdog right. They won't eat anything else, so this guy fed shit on what is it? I don't know, but neither one of those fetishes, that's true, but I I get what you're saying yeah. I really don't. I don't even know why I say just.

I really do so. We jump when your head and jerry fills a second grade, and that happens. It does happen, but he's got all kinds of weird stuff goin on these get. measles he's got swollen, glands layer enjoyed us and he asked it. He actually has to have a bunch of operations because he's got the some infections. So it's a major health issue. He does have some health issues, but it's at this point. He's also starts complaining of a lot of headaches, so much so that he says he can't even see a lot of the time. Oh it's like migrate at one. At this point. They actually do an I q test for gerry and it comes out to be pretty normal, okay, which you know

that for for what it's worth, but I think it's important information, so we jump to a J jerry and his family moved to a place called grants pass organ and its in grants pass that Jerry has neighbours that a couple of teenage girls, so he stood sneaking into their house with the girls brother and playing with girls clothes. It's not just high heeled shoes and we're gonna find this as we go along its Undergarments underwear, shoes, and even just plain women's general, what women's club dresses whatever yeah he's playing with it all. Yet his he's he's got a fascination that will lead

it's a fetish and maybe that's the way we should have set it right. Can a six year old have a fetish? Maybe it or would you call it a fascination I'd, say fascination that is ultimately going to lead to a fetish. Yeah, that's probably a better way to say it. So again, fast forward and little bed jerry's going through puberty fifth in sixteen years old and enjoy He's doing now it's a fetish because you he's doing some of the normal things that boys that age do right, and this is where start using the shoes, and underwear to aid, and in doing some of these things, but again, his mom is all over him. Yes, yes and she's, disgusted by anything that has to do with sexuality or anything else. Those lines and she

as far as making jerry washes. His bedsheets by hand has cause all stained here again how much of Her doing what she has done in an jerry, his childhood. Oh she she helps the ma. She helps create the monster. Maybe I mean I think he had this. This was a pretty strong fascination, but I think she she exacerbated exactly. I just wanted to use a big word and there you go. Thank you and I actually knew what it meant hey so also at this time. Gibbs. This is when jerry begins to have some our fantasies, involving like actually capturing a girl forcing her to obey him

every command things like that rights are, were he starting to slide off the cliff yeah he's go in a different direction. Right, and I guess you know a lot of people have finishes, there's nothing wrong with having a fat sources healthy yeah. Jerry Bruno's takes what could be a normal fetish. Here too, the nth degree way over the line now healthy and not haven't, wants to cooperate. We added a shrewd exactly. So at this point the family moves once again and they end up in or values or again and jerry just keeps on with his habit of. stealing womens shoes and underwear and at this point, is based

just using them to masturbate gnats mean that's what it comes down to he's using this as a fetish tool to aid in masturbation. Yes, exactly so gives, I think, that's that's jerry's life from birth up to sixteen, and now we ve got to jump into crimes because he starts committing crimes at the age of sixteen. And the first one involves stealing the underwear of an eighteen year old girl, but it doesn't in because he's been doing that all long right right so now he he decides aids for whatever reason that he's gonna ramp up Tom inertia- and he has thought, is that He wants a nude picture of this girl to use

instead of relying on the underwear there in his sexual gratification, so he sets up this very elaborate plot to try to get this girl to pose for it picture now. I can imagine that in nineteen fifty five timeframe, that was very easy to get an eighteen year old girl to pose for a new picture thinker, an easy, not that easy to take a picture and ninety one iota been hard to find a camera, and then you gotta take it to the local gotta, get it developed, geek allocated developed right. It's not like today know where everything is instant right. Snapchat gotta have your cell phone with you. I don't even know what half that stuff is but so that the plan that he comes up with is the asked the girl to come to his house with the

understanding that he's gonna help her github her get back her underwear, which he had stolen in the first place, but I guess she doesn't know this. now how he knows that its missing and Andy's. Maybe she told him more and clear pattern, so, however, it happens, this girl does come and when she gets there she's base glee attacked by a mass man with a knife. The mass man makes for take off her clothes and he takes several photo However, the man leaves the girl gets dress in and she fleas now asked he's leaving she runs into jerry, who said As I just saw the I just saw the guy. I was locked in the barn, but I I saw the guy run off now, we know this is like a scream situation right here. It sounds actually like, maybe that's where they got it from. Maybe they did.

But the girl leaves and she tells a police what happened now, however, did that he set it up in a pretty ingenious way. I shall give him credit. May hinges. This is not the right word by and is trying to be the hero, yeah heat I mean. Obviously he went from being the attacker to be the one that says, I'm so sorry, I saw him right, I'm here for you I'm here for you. What can I do to help? a year later, Jim, he is able to lure a seventeen year old girl into his car. He dry or to a deserted farmhouse any beats per se he's he's changing again. Yes, aggressions going right here before it's been all about stealing sexual gratification, even even the nude photographs. He didn't hurt that girl, but now he beats this girl. Pretty

badly now, there's a couple that stops at sea the crime and they they notify the police. Now jerry again here is this kind of story where he tells the police that he stopped to help this girl and that he was not the attacker. He was the savior yeah. I was here to help right now. The couple I think they they knew he was I didn't tell him the truth, because they had either seen him because, since the bullshit yeah, I'm sure yeah and it doesn't take the oregon police state police very long when they're questioning jerry and he confesses Now, because of that, they are able to search his house and car, they find you know women's underwear, nude photos no equipment and jerry enzo getting arrested for assault and battery. Now

happens to jerry, though, is that is committed to the organ state hospital. and the initial diagnosis is adjustment reaction of adolescence with sexual deviation in fetishism? That's a healthy diet, but the strange part about it is so he's here specialized in this state hospital, but he's aloud ten high school during the day. It's constraint right, so he asked this. Initial diagnosis, being held because of the assault and battery but they're like What during the day go ahead and go to school behind, all these women right, yeah you're Duncan here, eat your dinner and go to bed yeah. I I just didn't. I didn't get that at all

The thing is eventually: I do diagnose him as borderline schizophrenic, not surprised, but I think that was a very common diagnosis back then a lot of people would probably just thrown into that yeah. That was an easy. it sounds like a catch all year when they weren't sure exactly was going on with you. Your borderline schizophrenia. Right now Wasn't there I mean this was not a short term thing. He was there for eight or nine months, won't hospital eyes, but allowed to go to school Eventually, they lead go and say that is now danger to society after his release. Goes back. He graduated high school, but his gpa is very, very low, who sought the brightest one based off gps. based off gpa out how much that has to do with the fact that he was in a mental hospital

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hundred five hundred, that's audible, dot, com, slash de cat or text tcp tee to five hundred five hundred so gives with jumped in nineteen fifty nine june a bruno's is twenty years old join the army, now you and I have done a number of episodes, twenty one. On this to be exact, we just talked about it. How many of them serial killers were in the armed forces. Majority allow them the vow as the majority, I don't wanna disparaged arms forces at Also, I'm not saying it that way. I just don't know you know how much of it has to do with the time's right. The fifties in the sixth and yeah see, I would say, was at times because back in those years, I think

that was the fix all right. If you wore fitting in not for everybody to saying there is a handful of people that they would just if you weren't fitting in with the community the way you should have if your grades weren't, where you should have been, if you didn't go off to college, then you are pushed off and your parents pushed you off into the services or or that was like, or if you had your calling right, you got drafted no depend on what time it was ear was right, but I think the something to that. I thank god and he did go to college right for a little bare little burdensome vocational school to, but but

I do well and do dropped out. So I, like your, I do like your hypothesis, which is you know he had tried some different things. He he wasn't finding his path and a lot of people say well, you know I'm going to join the army, their structure there there's something for me to you know, that's a path for me to go down there, but I I just you know and we we do talk about it and I find it in sitting. I dont know that it means anything it's just in arresting that a number of these serial killers were in either the army or some branch of the arms armed services, but in things, don't go well for him. They are either he's having a heart. I am basically fitting in anywhere at this point because he only makes it I think six or seven

once in the army and at one point you know he's discharge for what was called bizarre obsessions yeah. I mean, but he went to go, see the army psychiatrist right and I'm sure Probably didn't. Take them too long to figure out that this guy's got something going on yeah he's he's not stable what I'd love. I would have loved to have been a fly on that wall. To hear that conversation between the army, psychiatry, wrist and Jaber I was back in nineteen, fifty nine they they wouldn't have even been able to run it out of him. You know best what the back then, if you try to run it yeah, you're discipline and issues or something I didn't like day, which is ryanair size. You run out of you thinking that they could, you know just get you

but yeah you're, not you're, not going to run this out of jerry burritos know was bizarre obsession as unless you're in high heels in front of them. Yeah that just make it worse, So you just released from the army, he moves back home and his mom doesn't let him stay in the house, so he has to stay out one of the shed on the free he, it was really loved yeah here by his feeling, whose love so love. So what this shed look like look like and how house warming it was, but again imagine have being great. But during this time he comes across a young girl and he follows her

home and he comes up behind her and he basically strangles her till she passes out, doesn't kill her job, but she passes out once she passes out. He steals her. Shoes takes him home back to his shed and sleeps with him every night because it makes them feel safe, safer. Like he's a stronger powerful person. That's something yeah, but I mean at least he didn't killer. I guess it's the only the only good thing, the only good thing I can say about that. I mean I'm sure she was scarred for life. Yeah haven't think having gone through that. So, let's jump up to sixty two, because this is when the next important thing and jerry's I've happens at this point is working at a radio station and key Meets in marries a seventeen year old girl named darcy they would go on to have two children and they

did up settling and salem organ. Theirs, strange things that came out about the relationship between jerry and darcy, one of the weirdest there is that early on, like honeymoon stage type staff who asking darcy to do all of the housework naked, except for only a pair of high heels, and he would sit around just taking pictures ever But at this time gives this is when the the headaches and up the migraines come back into the picture and maybe even some blackouts. He would say at this point. He starts having what he calls blackouts. Now again, a lot of this comes from him later in life right, and we always say that you have to you have to take some of this with a grain of salt, but his comments,

was that the only way to relieve his symptoms was to go out at night on these, what he would call raids right? yo, stealing shoes and wonder where we're late. Garments, the whole nine yards. You know, I think back in that time, it was probably a little bit easier to steal some undergarments, because people didn't really have dryer. So they lot of things I hung out to dry. So I guess it might have been a little easier just to walk past a clothesline and no, I think, that's a great point cause I, as far as I know, he's not breaking into people's houses. So I'm thinking he should stroll through the neighborhood What's on the close lines, and now I dont know how he's getting the shoes, though no I'm much sure about that, either so maybe he is having to break into two some houses, because people don't leave their shoes out by this is nineteen early. Nineteen sixty three.

Most houses, pray, weren't, even locked, yeah you're right about that we can add, have to take like sixty two to sixty seven, yeah there's a five year period here, where he's he's little quiet, at least when it comes to committing serious crimes. We held daughter right yeah. He did the daughter, but I dont think ever stops. The stealing of shoes and and To aware and women's clothing and things like that, but at this point he starts dressing and drag and the change. Yes, oh that's a little little bit of a change here and sometimes He would even where women's underwear and women's clothing under his own clothes. So whenever that feeling it gave him some type of feed to do that, and, as you said, this is when his second child is born.

Now. What's really interesting is what's going on and with his relationship with his wife s, changing it is aging because to the point where she was even led him in the room when the child is born So obviously something's not going right. Now, if you don't want your husband in the room with you, some some some yeah, she knows something now jerry would say later that this really upset him. Because of this now, like I said he claims because of what happened, he ends up. Stalking, another woman following her home and in the stocking period he's waiting for her to false he breaks into her house and he's

I do still her shoes, but she wakes up big mistake yet and jerry ends up choking. Her doesn't killer again chokes her till she passes out, but he rapes. This woman is so again he's always escalating, sk like the rest of the word, I was looking for. He doesn't up stealing your shoes and any fleas the scene, not this one. For me, as is a little different because it's almost like he wanted steel. The shoes of somebody that he coveted targeted right, he's not going into a random house and stealing a random persons, views or underwear restocking. He saw somebody here and he wanted that specific persons shoes sure. So I mean that that's telling me something black women.

and things are starting to escalate and it's really you know not very long where we get into jerry's first murder so gives were at january twenty six. Nineteen sixty eight. And a woman named Linda sloss and is going door to door selling encyclopedias is going to be a whole ton of people. Listening to this, that don't even know what an encyclopedia is yeah it. is that the iphone of the day it was the only thing you had with Google remember back in the day I mean, if you did a a book report, you had to have x like pdf, yeah yeah, and you better get to the library, for somebody in your class got the the the the h age, you need it right, that's funny! It's not funny because of bout was about to happen, break so she's going door to door, big mistake because she reaches jerry's house and

jerry convinces her to come in and go to workshop, which was like in his garage. I think so too tipp one. If someone wants you to go the workshop, don't go though joy there, I dunno, but I assume he is doing this on the pretence that she's gonna make assail schreyer he's gonna buy Monies in my workshop come on our somethin like that, but very quickly he turns, and he hits or with the two by four and then he strangled her kills or, but he doesn't just do it. Yeah he removes or clothes, and he dresses her with some of his own collection weird is very strange- is already wearing clothes like alive, well, not alive, but it dead

the grown up like a doll. He's he's changing a a dolls clothes almost like what he's doing yeah it's weird, but it gets for me it gets weirder, oh much weirder, because he ends up cutting off her left foot and puts it into a one of his high heeled shoes right and then he puts the whole thing in the freezer strange As my assumption is he's this a trophy, oh yeah and he's gonna. Keep this and he's gonna use this to do you know his Ang right over and over yep and that's you know it's something: we've talked about with serial killers as trophies right. That's that's a big part of some serial killers. They they like to take trophies so that they can relive the feeling or the

whatever sexual gratification they got during the act. My assumption, is it floods back into them right as he's holding this leg with a high heel shoe on it bizarre but yeah it's his turn on machine, then he'll do what he has to do in my one and they put it back in the freezer and till ends. It again right. now. I don't know what happens if his wife needs to get a pound hamburger is she didn't lighted over out of the way, tells us leg and high heeled here, oh dear he's at it again, the hallmarks of psychopathy or this lack of empathy. Entitlement narcissism motion killers, our psychopaths. It is the personality disorder that allows them to commit a homicide and come up and deal. her family as if nothing has happened.

I saw him got off one of her feet. He saved as trophy put it the freezer that he had, the took it out. It was a fetish ida, Mandeb put it female shoe on masturbated guff sexual arousal from self same some of the things that we said again. What I find interesting is the com, and about the separation of the family life And the serial killer life One minute is chopped off. A woman's leg. Put shoe it put it in the freezer and then basically walking upstairs to have dinner with his family yeah eating dinner, with his wife and kids like nothing normal day at the office on E. So that is the you know where to where they're talking about the the whole psychopathy yeah, no empathy, but also no bad imo

right, there's nothing causing them to feel bad about it again. Cs. First murder there were a couple of people- are women that go missing later on in nineteen sixty eight Stephanie vigo she's reported missing out of portland, and Jan whitney was twenty three years old. She was going to the university of Oregon she's reported missing and I think it's important to you know the previous ones. He says he threw him in the river, as this is kind of his thing. He dumps him in the bodies of water while and- and I think If I remember correctly, he even went as far as faking a flat tire on the bridge so that he could throw the body over the into the was a good way to do it and actually mean again. We hate to tell people how to do things better.

Thorough body into the river, if a cop comes up and ask you what you do and their better have you're jack in europe, the ranch yep you better- have an alibi for sure so they find Jan whitney's car at arrest. Stop on interstate five, so jerry's next victim is Karen's brinker and she was also a student. She is going to organ stay nineteen years old at the time and she was slow

added to meet her mom for lunch at a department store in downtown salem and she never showed up now. Her car would be found as well locked in a band in on the stores rooftop some time later, but again no trace of care. Now the one thing that's different about this case, sir. This incident is that there were two young girls that were able to tell police that they had witnessed a large man dressed in drag on that parking garage rooftop where Karen's car was ultimately found on that day. Sign I give so april of nineteen sixty nine, so that was march. Karen was in marge now we're just one month later.

and this is where jerry starts to ramp up at an incredible pace and again, I'm not really sure, ever was able to put it together of what was going on or what caused him to increase the frequency, the way that he did but he kicks it up and there, but there had to be. There had to be something so on the twenty first of April. he runs into a woman named sharing, would again end up in a parking garage and at portland state universe so again is targeting university. Yet right here, looking for a certain age, I guess yep he obviously he likes young twenties at this point in his life. That's young, twenties, girls! That's what he's targeting now. Sharon is a fighter and goodness to the point where

during the attack. She ends up biting jerry on the hand and drawing blood, but jerry's a really big guy. and he overpowers her beats knox wrong conscious. But at that point there is a car coming and this caused him to have to leave and run but share and survives thankfully, thankfully and but because of the way everything happened at this point in time, police are unable to connect sharon woods attack with some of these other university students right may think, have missing hence, but the thought is and how they tell me. If I'm wrong, he would have killed, share and would oh, I think so, and by sheer luck this car? and to come along and

scare him off the army. She sheep. I felt like she had a lot of that day because she survived bs No, I think you're right and especially after everything comes out and she realizes who this guy was hmm. I she had to feel incredibly lucky like. She had somebody sittin on her shoulder that somebody watching over her. Absolutely because a lot of others were not so lucky, but He said you know, he's escalating and he's escalating to the point where just the next day, he must be frustrated because his attack on churn why doesn't go down the way that he wondered too, and he tries to abduct a fourteen year old by trying to force

to her car yeah. Now somehow she's able to get out there. She escaped she escapes from aim luckily and so another person that again, after all, this comes out and sheep probably sees the pictures and knows who this guy was had to feel like she had somebody watching over right, but he's frustrated. So he just goes down the road not too much further to the middle school and that's where it eyes to duck somebody else. A girl is fifteen years old and she screams heat here. driving his moms volkswagen forming coming here, which you know which work then was kind of car. Member. I do not think it was so he's driving around. He tries to pick her up, but luckily for her, you know

She screamed she yells there's a neighbour in the front yard, and that scares him often and he pulls away so good. For her I mean that's what that's what she should do right yet did the best possible thing: scream rhine, yell, draw attention in all this breaks loose. Eventually, you know because of his picture in the paper. She identifies him as that's the guy to try pick me up, but back when I made the complaint so that that was on stolen the twenty. Second, I was on the twenty second tried to abduct two women, two girls yeah at this point right cause fourteen and fifteen, so he's he's coming down on age, which is weird, and that is weird right, because we just mentioned he's targeting early twenties college students, and he has a bad experience and then he said how switches to as I think you teenage daughter. I think he thought well, I can't

overpower a twenty year old, let me drop down to a girl fourteen or too thinly, where I can have a better chance of getting. You might be right. You know that's what he tries and it doesnt work form no, but it does make sense that, because the frustration or whatever he's going to pick an easier what he feels to be an easier target yeah. So, but that said both of those happened on the twenty second and then by again the very next day on the twenty third, a woman named Linda sally she's, twenty two out of portland. She disappears from a shopping center. She they're trying to buy gift for her boyfriend.

And she's last seen walking out of a jewelry store at about five thirty. Her car is ultimately found in the parking garage of the shopping center. Now what would come out later is that jerry had posed as a police officer to gain lenders, trust and ultimately had strangled her to death. So we ve heard every four. Yes, the badge the uniform, yet we ve heard more than once reassure me back. Then people probably fell for it a lot easier. Today I mean, even if you are a real police officer, I think people are going to look at you like. I don't think so. Yeah and police officers are. Are you know I. I feel bad for a lot of a lot of the good ones sure, but back then I think people really trusted police officers sure they really had a lot of.

Back for police officers, so yeah. I agree with you that in back then it would have been much easier to pose an and gain some based trust. But it's at this point that the police are putting all this together right. You ve got a number of college aged men and they start to think hey. We got a serial killer on our hands here so because this guy as I think you ve got a lot of law enforcement agencies from various counties. Various jurisdictions that are all coming together and. They're looking for a number of months and to all different types of leads on these missing women. Basically it's this guy out fishing by himself and he stumbled across.

As a body now he's on the long Tom river, twelve miles south of corvallis, and this is what may tenth so it's really just a month right after Bruno's kind of ramped up and went on this spree in a short period of time that this fisherman finds the body it's floating. You know on the top of the water he gets in his car again, no cell phones right. Nothing like that he's got drive to the nearest gas station, find a payphone and call the police, so sheriff's deputies- they. You know they book it out to the river and

They are taking a look at the body and basically, what they find is that the body's been tied using nylon cord some copper wire, but it's been tied to an automobile transmission. Now we know that's not a light piece of no material or some weight there, so you know I'm wondering now how he got ya? I understand how you can we dump? a body into a river, I think, would be tough enough right. How do you get a body that is tied to a transmission, a very heavy transmission there in the war So the water right there's no way you're doing out over bridge right. I wouldn't think so at

Maybe that's why you know it was reported that the body was floating near the surface of the water. There has obviously he he couldn't have got it in the deep part of the river So maybe he just thought: if you get into shallow but kept her underneath yeah that eventually the water would do, it's may not may be rolled. I dunno yeah. I am speculating now cause. I don't have all those details, but. So they take the body out of the water and they would later discover that this was lender. Sally she's, the one that disappeared from portland from the shopping center shopping, for something,

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style and gifts shop, etsy, dotcom etsy has now like we said we. We think the police have put a lot of this together. That there's somebody committing all of these. So because of that, I think it's clear that they believe there's gonna, be or bodies to search for in that same area ends. Oh they they start having the divers come out, dragging the river and just to come days later, they do for and the body of Karen springer- and it's found just I mean pretty close like fifty feet. Yeah from where they found Linda, say: Lee's body is tied down to yeah. Well and again, it's is tied down with a car engine, which is you know, even if it's a one of the small volkswagen

it still has some weight. I don't care what you know: yeah it it's not it's not a lawnmower engine. This is a car engine yeah. You know you usually need to look it up and then use that hoist right with this guy. walking around with this corridor on your shoulder you nor he's some kind of hercules. Like me this. This is some part. I can't figure out, though, how he's getting these women were seems like he dumped him at the same, What on times the long arm review a long time river, someone or if it you know, he's driving as if he has a truck or something that he drives back? That way, and backs lacks it up here, sit down like an embankment. Well, it's gotta, be it's gotta, be something like there's no way he's gettin up on the bridge listing all this over.

I'm sure we got some mechanics that are listening and I'm sure they could tells if they thought they could do that. I know for a fact: I can't lift a car engine yeah I can sew again, but not with a body would not with a body

So again, nylon cord is what he uses to tie the body to the engine. So gibbs, both victims, linda an karen. There found parsley clothes, but there is a real big difference that they find when they start to examine karen's body I mean on her body, jerry decided he wanted some souvenirs, so he cut off both her breast and at that point, when he did that he's stuff, the the holes with some paper towel taos, and then I guess he had some brawls of out of his collection and put one.

His favorite ones on her. So I guess he just he put that brawl over where he cut the breast off to know the hide, the wounds or what but yeah. For what reason. I have no idea, but he was one of the brawls from his favorite collection, but had but at because I was getting ready to ask why put paper towels in there, but that kind of makes sense if I think about it, if you're going to put the bra over top yeah, it's almost like the paper towels are replacing the breast that he cut off yeah. You know we he put clearly he cut the breast off put the bra on, but he stuffed the brawl, the the wounds with brown paper to give the Look of a fool, but she still had brass yes, because we know that he enjoyed having sex with the women, outreach, killed him

I saw me, it does come out that he was a necrophilia he enjoyed absolutely not just the other fetish, crazy stuff that we ve talked about,

but he actually had sex with the dead bodies he did. And so, if you, you know, you start off thinking. Well, that's crazy! Why would you cut the breasts and then why would you stuff paper towels in there? But if you put it all together now, it's still crazy. Don't get me wrong, definitely crazy, but it if I'm putting myself in his mind, which is scary, it does make sense, I'm sure to him that he wants a woman that looks like she has. You know for breast yeah before he has sex would force that body right, but so then it goes back to. Why does he cut the breasts off and we find out later that he actually takes the brass and dips them in some kind of resin or some kind of material

alright and actually makes paper waits out. Oh yeah, I mean who would want to breast paperweight. My dont want to press paper way in your office, I'd out where it is. I don't think the people at work would appreciate that know that today's world, you braggin trouble so familiar reasons but anyway. So just I mean to me: that's like. It said sick, sec and other level of sec. He's gotten feed off his victims and east, put him in high heels and storing in his freezer. Now he's got breast from his victims and make an paper it's out of them or any any any turned to having sex with dead, by which you can see the progression yeah right, it starts with fantasy. It starts with stealing object. from that women have warrior unaware, brawls, nylon, too

use for masturbation europe, but- and we ve talked about this a lot right. That can't be enough for some people forever they have. They have to go to the next level right. So eventually he commits you know a rape and then eventually he commits murder. Cutting off parts theo afoot, essentially so I mean you really can see and jerry Bruno's the progression of what in some people could be a very harmless fascination, slash fetish. Decker go on forever like that, and nobody would ever know about it, but that's not-

his mind, obviously no works. He chose to keep ratcheting it out at ratchet up until eventually he led to murder and necrophilia, and all that so obviously the the police are investigating all this and at some point there interviewing students at oregon state university, because obviously one of the victims went there and its this point did they find out that some of the female students have been receiving phone calls from some? I dignified man who claims to be a vietnam vat. Looking for a day, so one of the students actually goes out with this unidentified call on a day, I'm not sure why they would choose to do that, but they did. and this is may of nineteen sixty nine and during the day

The man makes some very strange references. He talks about dead women found in the river he talks about taking his a whose, with him away and strangling her so bad day, yeah you're not going to get a second date. No by talking about strangling somebody on your first date, but because of this she's freaked out, you know the date ends or whatever and she gets home. She calls the police- and she says this- you know very strange thing happened to me. She is a to give the police a description of this man, and what please ask her to do is to get back in touch with them. If the man calls back to set up a meeting or a second day, and of course jerry does we know it's jerry?

he contacts the girl the second time, and she immediately calls the police, but she sets up a date with with him. Jerry comes to pick her up and instead of finding his they chrysanthemum Chris handsome pops out you, the police, are there waiting for you, they interviewed jerry and they obviously you're getting strong vibes from him and they decide that they ve got to investigate him further, that he is definitely a possible suspect and all this stuff, it's gone down so It happens at this time. Gibbs is that one of the women that Bruno's had it attempted to abduct earlier is able to identify him in the fifteen year old and pick him out of a lineup,

And because of that that I mean that's, what gives the police the ammunition to get a search warrant for his house and they just find a treasure trove of staff at his house right, I find nylon rope which is going to match the rope that was used to tie the bodies to the the engine and transmission. They find the photos that he had taken of the victims, some of his victims. They also find some copper wire that was used. So I mean there, like you, said mike they're, they're, they're, they're, building a case, and I think a pretty easy case right, because you got photos of the victims,

Well, when you've got photos of the victims and different stages- oh yeah, this is not. This is not a glamour shot from the hmong. These are. These are bad photo yeah. He he liked to take pictures of them why they were dying. Yes when they were dead. So I don't think there's any doubt that at this point the police have enough evidence to arrest burritos and they do try to serving with a warrant and he tries to take off on them to get away from him. Now they got all this information and evidence for the warrant, but what they get the warrant for is not the murders. It's actually for the attempted abduction of the young girl

it occurred about a month before because of that they able to giddy man and their able to start the interrogation process. And one thing I found very interesting is that at one point words when jerry's in jail, he calls Darcy heats, trying to convince her to burn some clothing and other evidence that either have they must not have found and she's not having any of it. He's not gonna cooperate at all was now dead yet other thing I found very interesting is that through dose actually had friends and and that described him as a d the family man, he didn't drink, he didn't smoke and he didn't cuss. So we had that going for him sure now he was a he dressed in drag and he killed people.

and write them and cut their body parts off, but other net is a nice guy. He was nice guy. Just found that interesting. That, and I think that is you see that alot right people are leading to separate, come completely separate lives. they ve got there. I'm a family man. I go to work Come home, take two kids: the tea ball practice. I go church, whatever it is, so all their free These are seeing this person.

Hidden under me is the monster, and once the monster comes out, then they're doing and committing all these fine believable frog demon, the frog demon comes out right. It's that that part always fascinates me how people can lead that type, a double life, to the point that their friends are coming forward, saying there is no possible way that this person could have done. That could have done all that I've known him first, twenty year, just because giving as a K bar and travels the contrary right. There's no way to give you could have I'd have to stand up for you and say there. no way the gate. The gibbey used that K bar knife here, if his serial number matches the received that you found it, I don't care what him, if there's no, I know that picture looks like him and is not

im on that videos about him. So in early june now keep in mind. All of this is happening very quickly, right right march April may june, very quick Yes, when of course, some work well, so in early june, investigators are able to get jerry to confess and he confesses too the two murders of the women that they just covered the bodies right right. So that's karen and linda but he also goes on to confess to the murder of lender slawson. That was the woman. was selling the encyclopedias right and also, the gene whitney. Yes, this first known victim

maybe she's one of the ones we talked about in the very beginning didn't actually call her a victim. We just said she went missing. There was a couple of people. Stephanie video was the other one. I don't think he confesses to her, but again we talk about. there's two right, just because p, how many more? Could there be you? Never you never really piano more than they find a more that he met to bother Y yeah yeah, no doubt, but you talked about things moving quickly back then so within a week they make the big announcement, Jerome, Bruno's thirty years old he's been charged with four council first agree: murder and those firm four murders that he confessed to, but then that the grand jury meets

on june forth and they only had died him on one count, a first degree murder and that's the death of for the death of care in spring So too, that charge bruno pleads not guilty by reason of insanity and its. At this point they start testing name several psychiatry wrist, start testing jerry and actually say he has an above average, I q and cognition and all of em across the board say that he's not criminally insane? He knows what he is when he knew what he did was wrong right. He just didn't give a shit, but they still diagnose muslim labels. Oh he's got labels yeah anti social personality again. This. Fetishism right as a heart were to say by the way, transvestite ism.

exhibition, ism voyeurism and I think the one they settle on. That is really damning. Is sadism right, he's a safe seas, a sexual sate, as there is no doubt about that, but As this time you know their store investigating him. The evidence continues to mount an they ultimately, charging with three counts. First agreed murder and that's forward an whitney linda, say Lee and Karen sprinkler. At this point he decides to take back his not guilty by reason of insanity plea any plead guilty, and this is what our again utah about things moving fast tat very same day. He sentenced to three consecutive licences, but good that day that he pleads guilty. Here I mean wrapped up done.

For now there is, and the reason for that is because there there's no no death penalty in oregon right, I assume, if there was he would he would have been. I would think he would have been placed on that, now the one thing we so we said three and that because he was not charged with the murder of linda Slawson, because they never I find her body my assumption with that Gibbs oundle, which you think is that they had three already. They knew that they had him yeah. He he was going to go to prison never come back and that he was never gonna get out. So I kind of hate that. for the family of linda Slawson, but. I'm sure they have closer, I'm sure they know he did it yeah there glad it tat. He wrote it away in prison yeah, but you know we're sure they wish they had may the buried. But so we say it's all wrapped up. It's got a nice bo on it, but that doesn't stop the investigation, because there were a total of twelve women that went missing.

In in and around the area where he lived during the time before he was arrested so that investigation kept going and this is where things can go a little crazy, because a neighbour of the brutal says. I send it right sure. I'm asking you now, but a neighbor implicates doc see his wife in one of the murders claim net darcy help jerry carry the body out of the garage incur now. This goes. Do what you and I were saying. How is body. Now I dont know how much dark. How much help darcy could would be more because my mind whether you're talking about

an engine or something like that. It would take multiple men or a hoist like, like your theory, was, if you can hoisted in the bed. the truck. Maybe you can push it out and let it roll. I don't think your wife's going to be able to help you carry an engine no, and it goes back to I mean we've had other cases where you would have thought the wife would have known right away. You can go back to oh, the the the mass murderer guy in Indiana, where he hit the nightclubs, her baumeister baumeister. You have thought his wife with all those bodies buried in the backyard in to the fact that her son actually brought some bones to her skull or said she just thought it was something from from an old long time. Right I mean yeah, so you you know, does the wife really know who I dunno? I think that's a question that you have:

in a lot of these case, sure how it? How do you not know if he's got a frozen for in breast for a paper way, but maybe she does never goes, Maybe he does all the cooking. Maybe he's got the freezer lockdown here who knows, but. molly darcy is charged with eighty. in a bedding first degree murder- and this is for karen sprinkler They have a trial. She testifies. but she is found not guilty sure she claims she had. No involvement and the jury believe that yeah. Now she does divorce. Jerry, shocker, smart, move, It changes her name, which I don't blame her and moves on with her life, probably one of the smartest things she did during that time. It's also said that she wouldn't let her

kids, go see her father or even write to her father or write to them YAP. If I heard I had that too yeah would wouldn't even let him wouldn't even let them write a letter to him right, let alone go see her. You didn't deserve it. That's for sure! No, I I don't blame her one bit, so we have to about jerry's time in prison because fearsome in interesting stuff, here, as buzz, is what I'm thinking you're gonna say it's definitely a normally. We don't talk about this part, but we have to because it said that jerry Bruno's had piles and piles of win his shoe catalogues in his cell, somehow He was writing to all these companies, basically asking them to send their care logs to him and in the letter he was putting that these costs logs were his substitute for puck. Pornography is basically telling

hey. I need these catalogues yeah. This is what I use. There's my masturbation material, exactly yeah, so I you know I thought that was crazy, that they they actually would send them here's your sears catalogue reactor she pennies or whatever was back in the day wore worse now, as most people he played guilty. But he lodged appeal after appeal and one of the reasons he used was that one of the photographs taken of him with one of the victim Corpses, ok was should not have been enough to prove his guilt, because the reason Is he saying that that's not the body of one of the people that he was convicted of killing So he's not saying I didn't pose with a dead body here just saying was,

body. If it's not it wasn't one of the three or four people, the three people that you convicted me out. So the question is: who was it then somebody else that, we didn't know you killed, but he had jerry had a lot of trouble in prison. You know he was beaten regularly by inmates which I don't think anybody's going to lose a whole lot of sleep over now. The most interesting one, I guess is in nineteen seventy. It was said that he was treated for rectal bleeding That was classified as being caused by hemorrhoids or and I'm using air quotes other, and I think we know what that other is. I think we do and again don't feel bad for him. I don't feel bad for me at this This was a bad guy. He hurt women, he killed women

I'm not condoning nap, but also, at the same time, not not feeling rule real bad for jerry bruno say: backs a bitch where it is So we mention that jerry get three licences. but somehow he was up for pearl in nineteen. Ninety five, the probe, board, voted to ban him from ever getting parole. What I didn't understand, is that it was said that, even though was banned from ever getting parole. We're gonna, allow him to interview with the board every two years. None of that made sense to me. their basically saying, you're, never gonna get out, but we're gonna. Let you please your case every two years. So in ninety nine he goes up fur parole. I swear I'm calling it he's doing this interview he six years old.

They don't give it time they ve already said he's not gonna get it. Why go through the motion and the pro board comes out they basically say to the victims. Families were promising you jerry will never be set free at one of these, parole interviews, which happened every two years? You know obviously they're asking him questions and one of the questions was. You know jerry. Why did you commit these torturous murders that puts you in prison? He offered no response other than to say that this hearing was not the right forum for me to talk about it. Yeah he didn't want to talk about it. He use some lame excuse that he didn't want it to get out to the local press of what he said and didn't get out to the victims, families things like that,

so that was his excuse. Till we get to the end. Eventually, Bruno's dies in prison on march twenty eight two thousand six any dies from for cancer, and I guess the only interesting thing about it was that at the time he was he had spent most time in jail or prison. Have any inmate in the oregon department of corrections. Okay, so he'd been in for thirty seven years, nineteen sixty nine to two thousand and six when he died. He was a record holder, yeah, I'm sure. Maybe somebody passed passing by now. Imagine so in two thousand and six he he he had that going for him but

That shows that here and that's the strange and crazy story of jerry brunos, weird, whereby man we're guy that's understatement of the year jay bird us we're getting we're guy. Our I dead it for this episode, a true crime, all the time for my angry stay, save and keep your own time taking.

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