This week on the votes cast. You talk about the big twitter hack with rustled random, also little bit about whether the? U S, government can actually man Tik tok in why then julie, Alexander, joins us to talk about peacock new streaming service from NBC that launched this week and there's a little bit of Fox news, there's always xbox news as of now and the broadcast support for this show comes from american express business if you're a small business owner, you want to partner with someone that can help make your day to day a rewarding experience. That's where american express can come in american express business cards. are built for your business with features and benefits like the ability to earn membership of points and select cards, the power to pay for big business purchases and twenty four seven support from a business specialist built for your business. Amex business terms apply, learn more at american, express dont, come slash, business cards.

Donald trump is facing ninety one. Felony charges across four indictments, but one charge Georgia stands out. The rico case against donald trump in georgia, involves nineteen the candles and, when you have a case involving nineteen defendants and the wide range of crimes that they ve been charged with committing, it creates all kinds of complications, the ins and outs of legal bases, and what this could mean for twenty twenty four this week on the way where are your chest flagship broadcast staying at home and wearing a master, that's all. I want you to do yeah Moved on fully to instructions, I'm you I'm a friend due to brown is here. I need more synonyms. Her friend pal buddy, chum russell brand. Is here I'm the secret enemy, a loaded.

Is Julia banners hi it's too early for this game, of whose a friend and it's it's everywhere. Every british hasna starts extremely coated phrases urge castle. Now what are those annoying dinner parties like murder, mystery dinner parties in podcast form? Hasn't it always been we're come out late today, on a friday, we are recording on friday morning, because a lot has happened this week. I want to start is always apology, circumambulate, where we met Oreo central next week. I hope as always by pointing out that it has been eighteen weeks in america, since Deborah Burke solvable flowcharts next to donald trump, saying that there'll be a national testing apparatus, we could go to a website, those being built by, louis forty five million google engineers and there make a website trump thank google we get a test in the parking lot of a major retailer? You know the whole eighteen weeks. That's where we're at it hasn't happened yet,

Verily is making some kind of website. There is some testing. I think it's obvious, there's not enough and testing results of actually said, which is bad. So that's where we are for chart. I want to dedicate the flowcharts Count to Kurt trader has remained a mistake this week. This is true, so Zoe megan wrote about clubhouse, yeah. He sees x and journalists club there's two companies for club ass, theirs, as the secret beta at an hour, it like ted talks, meets the red. It clodagh us like its a podcasting audio start up its and bayonets very popular is very exclusive. That's only wrote about there's another clubhouse, that's a project management tool and when

it made the art the art that went out on twitter had the wrong clubhouse logo, encourage traders to see a club asked me to us. We fixed it but he's verge, cast, fan and he's like. I look forward to the flowchart cancer. Cart, that's for you, colleges with their own logo. That's the it's! The only way you get free call outs on the show the good clubhouse, that's what I'm saying other virus updates again. There is actually huge needs. This week we gonna cycle to twitter hack. We gotta talk about potentially somehow the government banning tik tok julius here, another streaming services launched the just keeps happening. If anyone wants to do or not netflix earnings out, there's a lot of talk about, as I say every week there to do too your stories in our lifetimes that we all remember that most warmly to events or life there is the pandemic. Obviously, the measures that the racial justice movement in this country, which is quickly becoming a bit basement so Our teams are covering that stuff. We spend a lotta time on it. It's our priority. I know on the show. People want us to talk about attacking us, so we do that, but I just want to give some updates on arrival

average. The white house is reportedly order hospitals to bypass the cdc drink over nineteen data reporting think can say this to the votes cast audience messing with data reporting is bad. Rightly, What you measure, how you measure, like I'm assuming our audience, says that stuff is complicated. It is, it is important to get it right it changes the results depending on how you measuring what you measure. So that's a fight, that's going on Cdc itself is beset with controversy, please or saying the agency as a culture of racial aggressions. That's too, that the historian world intersecting right there at sea sellers at sea is a platform for him in goods. I think is, describe and sell their offering sheer face masts that actually don't protect you from anything. So in terms of platform, moderation, which is like a constant topic on our side, show there's a lot. Therefore, etsy russian hackers are targeting vaccine development. There's a lot.

Vaccines in development, disrupting that is problematic, eating a real, but that there is a huge thing happening. The trump administration has used the pandemic to crack down on immigration. Various ways a fight they played out this week and we're gonna just keep watching it. First, even since at any foreign students, and especially on soon visas who were not and in classes in person had to go home now enormously controversial for a variety of reasons. Seventeen states I have a lawsuit against the administration and the administration pierce to back down, watching very closely. We have again just our audience. We look at it. A lot of people in our audience are very interested in how that my play out, following it very closely and, lastly, we're all just spending a lot of time at home, so Justine Calma, one of our great science reporters interviewed Emily anti us to talk about how spending this much time at home might affect your health might affect how we change habits. That's a great story. I encourage everyone to read it. So that's like I said there. There are two gigantic stories in the world and never want to

act like we're not spending most of our time. Thinking about them, but the feedback I get from our audience is you know everybody needs a break and quite honestly, we all do too. So, let's talk about some techniques. Russell! It's like exactly as is like my bedside project. Is everyone thinks we're unicycle? Forget it like Russell, what horrible things have asked: the incidents, security or others so before The horrible thing I just want to. Let everybody now that I'm feeling grateful and I'm doubling all payments set. To my mind, I wonder if you in may two thousand dollars. I will send back two thousand dollars, but am only doing it for the next thirty minutes. This is a joke that can only be made by somebody with access and twitter. painful judaism lies at its word. So this is your time I take you break I'm taking a forced brain pappy, so we should start at the absolute beginning right. So many people yesterday opened up their twitter client.

to see that these prominent accounts were tweeting what dieter, just sad and so we're tongue like elon musk bill gates, Jeff bezos apple, and so they treaty, I am giving back to my community. If you send me back point to this address and it had the blockchain address. I will and back double the vehicle, and he will say should have been the first, the first hint that something was wrong with Jeff Baiser, saying I'm good that's a joke, I stole from twitter. When I still I mean someone tweeted that when I still had access to twitter but ok, so these people did not mean to treat this. This was a scam but- the interesting thing is these are like high value accounts. I think it's fair to say that, like probably jeff basis and apple, of every available account protection that like twitter,

First, like we'd, they really round the table, like Joe Biden got hit. The official barack Obama account as well as a number of fake barack obama counts, and so it wasn't just the day, had installed some sketchy application or that they hadn't turned on to factor like this was sort of the crown jewels of twitter account and they were just doing to absolutely ever, and so I mean in the verge new and actually this is like, I think a fun moment does not always come through in the coverage. So you know they were tweeting out the blockchain address right which it was always the same address which actually had it been a more sophisticated thing. It would have been harder to track if they change he addressed. But anyway, if you do crimes hackers, if you're listening, try to change the dress- and I said We were all just watching, you know we did a twin. Search for, show me every tweet that has this address and we were just

watching them role in and then two minutes after they posted they would get to lead as like the accounts and twitter itself were scrambling till I get a hold of it, but they would also come back at first in some cases again it post and then delete and then reappear, because it's like this other person has access to your account. So you also have access to your account, but they have access to so you delete the account and then they tweeted again There were a bunch of different elan ones. Yeah and so were at the same time, because its bitcoin and bitcoin is distributed. ledger and we all love it. You could see the the payments that were rolling into this address as people sort of try to take up basis on this offer. It seemed like they were paying out, like bitcoin was also leaving the address, but I don't think that it was paying out to people like or anyway, most people who paid this kind address did not pay. Just lost money, as you would expect,

site just if Jeff basis in person walked up to me and said if you dollar I'll give you two dollars. I believe you are What it's like there's a part of me. They just wants to know who paid the money. One of the payments was like forty, two thousand dollars? We need to extra thousand dollars to be like. What's there to fly on the super tweet, I there's a part that I will never understand. I do appreciate, though, that, because it started with e lawns twitter, there was like a five minute gap People were like assist just isla tweeting about bitcoin, then like and then the very serious account starkness greeting like oh no. This is the thrust of the arts you'll unjust thousand tonnes of eel stuff, like you see just doing drugs with kanye right now, because I was see if this works at first, it was like this is just a thing. That's happened to you. I must can bill gates, but then pretty soon it became clear that it was

like every single account on twitter was vulnerable to this, and they were just going down the list of like stuff they could find, which is not. If your twitter, it's not good. It's not good. Looking at twitter, I think I'm not at risk of being a biased journalist to say that this was bad for twitter. not an end, so they shut down the ability to tweet at all for verified accounts, because big it was primarily verified accounts that are being tweeted like if it's some random account, that's less you're, less likely to pay a coin to that person. I guess so then, of course also the the politics of verification, which is a a lovely and healthy the recession that is ongoing on twitter became a there are a lot of jokes about that. I mean that was. That was a deeply funny moment right when everyone was just dunking that the blue text and tweet like that was pretty funny but it is also like again if you are running twitter,

This is a real like we have to shut down the reactor moment of like what we can't let at which regions let any of the major accounts tweet at all until we get this under control, which is true so also and I say this because its affected me personally, as well as Julia, so some victims in this, in addition to the people who lost actual money because they were sort of dom about this. But if you he's your password, when you are seeing that this was happening, which I did but a natural thing, You re, like oh shit, something bad is happening. I should change my password. I actually had like an exceptionally weak twitter password. I use the same, I'm just going to say and like not, was, was very weak, but it had been. I had like used it in a lot of accounts,

it had been in previous breaches, soul. I was going to ask you if you could tell us what the password was. I had to factor out. No, I can't, as I still have I'm still using it for other stuff. as I say like our time to time, to look. We all make mistakes. no one saw through imperfect. When you write about the mistakes, I often assign you stories in coverage. Factor like I too factor didn't have any sketchy stuff they weren't gonna, get it by guessing. The password that's like saying. Like you, don't I the house where, but it's ok, because I had a kind of like work like this I thought you too early for that. If I had it to do again, I would at six thirty in the morning where you are: what are you doing that actually explains everything directly anyway, I have been punished for my lapse, because do you know when

I compromise your account. The first thing that they do is change the password to a password that only they know, and then, if they're like who does this account really belong to build their like. I know the password and that guy doesn't know the password. So it's mine right, because very natural things oh, they especially locked down any accounts that had recently had their password changed and they have not cared a ton about restoring access those accounts, so not only can I not tweet, which is pretty bad, I can't even see tweets measures better well, I feel like it sort of like You know in bad man. We're like Bain has like the juice that makes them strong, but also makes him like psychology. My language use thinking like twitter. What does that mean that thing Like I love this happen to Russell, I wouldn't do it defies stages of grief within like an hour of not having twitter I was

like panicking, and then I was like trying to bargain with like the twitter guys and hurriedly I'll tweet less. If I can just tweet once it's a sickness through at her relationship to this at the sick, I will tweet less. If I can just tweet once that is before us, The most jammed reviews editor dan safer to billy. Can you tweet for me a perfect, I thought that's all so this happens, we're all having different levels of psychological crises. What in but now it seems like we kind of no. What actually happened, how this happened down yet at the same time it this was happening. What we do know is there were people on the criminal corners of the internet who were so of selling access to internal twitter tools, which are the sort of things that you would used to reset accounts in this way, so

This is sort of the the like landlords master key, and there are versions of this at most social networks like if you want. You know when you're talking to the guy. google saying I need to reset my gmail like this, is the key. Has that you're trying to convince him too use. They are really really not supposed to fall into the hands of people who will access to them on, like random computer crime forums like that isn't not, and I should say like that. The reason that we know this is because of this great reporting by my mother words, Joseph Coxe, who, who is sort of was at the head of line on this. The question of all that happened, so I mean the end. This is assuming that that that is in fact, a source of the breach, which I think is by far the most plausible explanation. We own a hundred percent no, but it really seems like that's what happened so was that someone who worked for twitter and had access to these tools got hacked

and then they got the master key from that guy, or was it that one of those people sort of was actually working for twitter, and was just like you guys, don't pay me in her flock going had now there's precedent for that, because twitter I actually had state sponsored spies, working for it was, in the past year to get saudi arabia technically who s ally, but they ve done some things. yes, so it's real we back there. members of congress and like Joe Biden we'd like to know how this happened and what they're doing their twitter dot com anyway, because, like it is at this point, it's not just that like russell and Julia like to use twitter. It's it's sort of a central. send like if you're suddenly

control of a major channel of communication from like the president of the united states and this guy who's running for president, unlike where, however, we're going to describe you, I must lie that's a problem. That's a society wide problem, Some is at the heart of it right. This is a pretty does you are describing unsophisticated bitcoin, scam, in the end they needed just over. I think a hundred thousand dollars does just over there, which is it If I was joking about that, he would do it like if you compromise all those accounts They were didn't free money, and you owe me now thousand dollars like most, we weren't gonna, believe a scam of that of that sort. That's really ineptitude. The question I have is widened. The attackers know that what they was so much more valuable right. the russian government has gotta be we'll just pay any amount of money for for this opportunity. Well, so I do think-

that one is oh like so it's very scary for someone to get those keys. Obviously I think one thing that I would emphasise that may be. Brings that into perspective. Is they did not have this power for very long like we're talking about a few hours in which they have and that was obviously an extremely chaotic few hours and it was a few hours that was extremely damaging to twitter. But if the point is that you're gonna, like hack donald trump account and he's like I'm going to war with canada and some in your life, this is crazy or he's drop point of nato or something if a few, hours later there like there was this twitter compromise. I didn't say that then the overall impact of that is now a bit, and also I mean You are literally a criminal and you just want money to buy a fancy jet ski, like that, duff doesn't, do you any good, and so

I genuinely think that, like this weird bitcoin scam was plausibly. That kind of economic optimal choice of how to monetize this access, just because you can like mess with people. But what can you really really do what you can in theory really really do? If you have full account, access is look at the dams, yeah, there's a way potentially more viable. Frazier saw it be that the answer to your question eli? Is that the reason that they did this thing? It seems like it was just a bunch of kids having fun with bitcoin is because this was just a bunch of kids haven't found a bitcoin That is one of the things in the world. The possibility in that's like also scary, that this wasn't sophisticated, cosy, bear russian hackers. This was you know like script kitty, and if, in fact, that you are more sophisticated than that I dont please, I'm not I'm not casting his person You stay away from a twitter account, but possible that the levels

indication here, a super low like twitter that didn't know what to do and they just like shut shut down. It seems like they're admin panels for access to very important accounts up all the way up to, but maybe not including donald trump was just available to somebody. That probably should, have had access to it and then, when it all went down there is like well, we I really know what's happening, nobody can tweet and that's how we fix it. For now laughter I mean if you're, twitter, or actually, I guess, if your facebook ad do you get on a call like as an executive with twitter execs and be like hey what happened to use that way. We can prevent it happening to us cause. I feel like that would be my main concern. It'd be like this could happen to. I assume a lot of places. you think facebook is probably like laughing. Are ass? I saw her at the time of their lives, fishermen who so The answer your question is like: yes, that's what security people do this?

please and that's why twitter it like you, you look it twitter support. It's like tweeting out information about what happened in detail because its Twitter is best interests to share. It happened, it's all the applicant countries. Central interest to know what happened there is that level of community. I think for those kinds. Professionals to jack dorsey call marks are bergen me like you ever here's what you should do, there's a button we back at my house, but all of them People stop tweeting. I just hit that button. I don't know if you've got that button, but you should get one like. I don't know if that happened also, I would love for jack dorsey to have that button and like display it prominently. I appreciate that jack dorsey's tweet With this axe, I was waiting for him to say something, and then his tweet was like rough day at twitter. Yeah he's like I'll be at square heel. I got another job and then there's the other part of that. I do think facebook The other big companies are some laughing and like mark soccer

in a little over a week is a sharp and from congress in an anti trust hearing in the eye. What is at stake. Is a keeps saying it he's gonna say: are the amount we and on trust in safety and security is more than twitters revenue. They hated his favorite dumped in the world. he's like I'm spending more that whole company makes I should run all social networking in america slush world and have all the money, because that's how I can protect you, the american got like that's his mode of operation write his motives. I have this massive scale and I can do a better job and small companies, and so on. This is a gift for him, but I dont know like sundar doesn't operate that way, but he's going to be up there too, and he's got the same gift right, like youtube's, big and should probably be bigger. what if I ran the only video service on the internet, like that's, a move I will say the one? wave. The this could be a problem for facebook down the road is there is like so

we're talking about platform moderation, one of the the sort of perennial questions for the verge and and kind of specifically verge policy is when platforms do bad things it's like. Can the government punish them like how? How is the government able to respond and say, hey, facebook? Don't do that, I and the government has not really. The government really wants to be able to do that, but they have not been very good at and I think for this purpose. Finally- and this is something Mckenna as it is currently chasing and and will be writing about the fcc. The federal trade commission is sort of shit. Dish and only when you have some kind of corporate screw up that impacts consumers this. Certainly, did they

are the ones who come in and sort of rap the knuckles of the corporate world, and they have not been super empowered to do that. Lately I mean, I think, that they find facebook some billions of dollars for the cambridge analytical thing, but it was understood to be a real life. that they sort of got off easy bides this? I there are a lot of people. The next turn that we're gonna see from regulators is. Will this Why? We need the f tc to have some real muscle. We need them to have some muscle in this case in particular, and We wonder if then it's time that gets used its against you tube or against facebook or against. You know, whoever that's, maybe an optimist. protection for the future, but we'll sit I do the other. It's like us, because I'm just thinking of it as soon as a bitcoin centric thing. That's the idea of congress asking you to promote bitcoin scams like that's. What right

If you didn't know videos bitcoin I'll, give you a big. And the legal response or the lawmaker response, you know, summit I've seen some letters, the fbi looks like it's looking into a now. But some of the letters from lawmakers say things like security. on our abilities are not acceptable in its like. Why is that the standard. I don't know that we should have an internet like that. That's just a reality, The question is: can twitter or other companies explain sufficiently We are constantly mitigating the vulnerabilities that are created, and I dont know where that wine is, I dunno where oda. By definition, they don't know about the vulnerabilities that are. export for all. They know what other users like raising a really weak password on there on the platform, it's happened, how about nice or is there not talking about that like this, is really like? You know, you're not supposed to screw up this badly

new, screw up a little girl. Slide, but this is clearly to big of a screw up- and you have like you just this, Congress has enough on their play. They don't need to be worrying about, like social network security. It's just that was so bad that now roger wicker has to take time out of his day to talk about how we should run twitter like we very focused on raw broadband, I'm gonna be asked Europe the incorrect, etc You said that the time factor was like made. It not. I have all the more I think about that? I agree with you if you're after is money, that might be a thing, but if this and on election day and Joe Biden, an apple and over and bill gates were like don't outside invoke. The pandemic is worse than ever. Five g. as is corona cassettes, what bill gates would say

I guess you delete that just because I don't want even like a slight trickle more. The recent arranging going out there, but I trust our audience bill. I give that happen. election day that sets that changes the course of american history. They were not going to re run. The election is twitter yeah. that to me is like a nightmare global security crisis. I think to go back to like the tea. In analogy like If someone steals your car, there are lots of bad things they could do with your car, like they could be looking through your glove compartment into weird, I indeed theft things where they could pretend to be you and like pick up your kids from school and like it would be horrible, but, like generally, cars get stolen and if it's like and what happens is that like either they sell them or they like drive around too fast, and just leave them around because are idiot teens, and so I just sort of feel like

There is this aspect of like is thinking of the absolute worst thing. A person could do really going to give us insight into the nature of this attack, or is it just like cars get stolen and we should try to keep them from going sullen and it's like potentially bad, but it's usually gonna be idiot teams, I dont have every time I test out an audio system. The Santer I phases baby driver, so, like my head is indifferent to spot, than yours, like you, still car Sarah banks. As my understanding, so you teens there very upset because secretary pontio, keep saying he's going to ban tiktok yeah. What's in avonlea tiktok rights, oh, there are sort of to alternate explanations for this. They combine in an interesting way. So one thing that people say is so tik tok. We know it. We love it. Kids dancing its

a vibrant social network. Unlike previous sort of acts like this, it is owned by a chinese company. Bite dance Sometimes I get cute and there like. Oh it's incorporated in the cayman islands, and our offices urges in california, but like by dances, a chinese company, Tik tok, the app doesn't operate in china, but it's the non china offshoot of destroying you think so, I wrote a thing about this, I think. Fundamentally, the question is just: are we comfortable with their with, like americans and other people? outside of china using an app that is owned by a chinese company that could potentially be pressured by the chinese government. Knowing all the things that the chinese government- specifically, and so this is sort of the way that, like MIKE pompey talks about it,

like our we're. Looking at it, we might ban- and I don't know which is like add he wrote a thing about how what do you mean by ban like what does that look like bitter? Obviously there are things to federal government can do if you are an app that would make your life difficult, but so the other explanation is it a bunch of tik tok teens played up. Frank on donald trump, oh, my god and he's like mad and silky, wants to like take away their app, which would be really like. That's a very stupid chain of events like what that's like? That's the most twenty twenty chain of events that in many ways is just like I'm coming around to the idea that that is actually what's happening here, and you just have a lot other people who are alike There are some thing could say about. Why were doing this. The

sound unbelievably stupid, and then we talk about like their posts, talk rationalization of it when really it's just like trump got clown by these teens and he's mad online very thinks he got clear by these eddie. Here's trump had this rally in tulsa and a bunch of tik tok teens register to attend, and but they didn't actually attend a bunch of cape hop fans organized to register, attended like and then nobody showed up, and so the white house had. Oh man, we've got like four million people they're going to show to this event. They like made an overflow event outside, and then it turned out like actually not that many people. then even fill the arena, and so every like, oh well, tiktok tik tok did that they they they they d actually like screwed up this this event now whether not the way actually knew that nobody would show up. Who knows they are? Obviously,

white house and their track record for being honest about attendants. Numbers is not great, but I think rustles way that objectively, like they got glound, because everyone is like ha maybe they made funny you in there. There was some sort of effect there. Yet, like I dont think the objective laid down wider, is low attendance. If what you're worried is like people laughing at you, which, I think is kind of? What trump is worried about motivates donald trump yeah. They achieved that or his his strategy is now my administration will the way he's mad and he's kind of talking about it. Tiktok has been like preparing for something like this for awhile, because they distance themselves as much as they can from bite dance. I mean literally from the move, like moving a bunch of their security teams to american base security teams to like moving to burbank and setting up a huge campus

and poaching and executive from the most american thing in the world, which is disney till I run their company. Who has I mean all the downside very good reflection, which I picked up a havana like making and then I think, even more importantly, making him the co, for I can ignore efforts, presidents, where rico executive by death itself on toppling the ceo of america, tik tok like they are aware that this has been coming like they ve been preparing for it Why moment russell and I'm excited for it to blog up for the verge when it happens, is when Kevin Mayer, ceo tick. Tock goes to washington to talk to congress. I want us to redo the market Look you're burg, we sell, add senator to make it. We do dances closer. You re really good point you gave they have moved Tik tok as much way from china in china, like the perception of chinese influence, either the approach, in Hong kong, tik tok is no longer operate,

in hong kong and by dancer dislike just used in our chinese up, because hong kong is china. Now that's fine. Everyone agrees with that, like the other than like they just Davis. They have adopted a chinese governmental frame that hong kong and they have taken Tik tok out of that and put to an end, which is the chinese version of tiktok. I would also say, like specifically its about court orders, and you know the protests in hong kong we're about this new security law, and it was just clear that anyone operating in Hong kong was going to have to abide by these rules. That are not unusual for mainland china, but extremely repressive by the standards of like western liberal democracy right. So and I think that varies is sing of of so when they were having this whole conversation, tik, tok, the? U S, folks, are able to say,

we've never responded to a court order. From the chinese government, because we don't in china, and so we would never because they have no jurisdiction to ask us for anything. And this is- I mean how effective that line is, is an open question but like item, so I dont believe it. To be perfectly honest, I think that if, if you wanted to- void ever getting a lawful access request from the chinese government like this is how you would set up. Your company is just like we're staying very far away from china, and so they have no, their domestic law Enforcement operation has no like reason to talk to her.

I think that the concern isn't will a lawful request out of the governor who govern for china be the problem that the concern is all of the other does not follow the rule of law. The stuff happens under the table. All the stuff happens outside of like here's, a document that shows that we have asked for this thing. It may be that tik tok us up in such a way that the mechanism for that under the table suffers very difficult or impossible by, like fundamentally there's no way to know, and so I think a lot of people would just feel more comfortable. If it, there were dirty that sort of the chinese government's access to what our data exists on tik tok weren't there there's there like other question of the way that tik tok works, as it has an algorithm, because it's a feed because that's what the internet is now is feeds controlled by people that like who knows what they're doing and what do they want to do it, and so its past

well that like they, could use it to as propaganda. Like all of a sudden, you just stopped seeing a certain thing that tiktok doesn't want you to see and like why not I dunno this is what's weird about this argument. Is it sounds exactly the same as a bunch of like I've been shadow and I'm so mad arguments that are in bad faith, that we here out of like the concerted way, But u s social media it so like that confluence of impossible to know who's arguing in good faith is impossible without the algorithms are actually doing makes. All of this. Just like ma, like that, That's my response to this whole situation is just well and then like from tiktok perspective. It's you know it's not a great time. They're, the biggest their biggest audience or user base was in india at that then they got banned there and their second biggest user bases in the. U s and forget span there, that's a huge amount of there's there suddenly gonna lose to competitors and people

and you know, and then from the creator angle itself, like we think about aversions like palsy and craters. It's like there's a lot of kids and a lot of adults on that. App that like have found a community, especially while they're stuck at the who are like really like that they go For me, it's like. I say this all the time. It's like it's the only good app and like I have it's like the only thing that brings me joy right now, and so the idea of not having it is like detrimental not only to tiktok business, but also to like a huge swath of people around the world. like really loved the app what it is if to to tik tok its banned, the influencers go to youtube or they could have facebook reels, thereby talks the thing, is I talk to you to bring about this and they are lake when this happened last time when a bunch of viner as one member vine when they laughed when they went to you too, because they were making money online. If I was going to shut down day the album worked in a way that really benefited them, because they just like skyrocketed so like you're, you're, Paul brothers and and all of them the albert

it's changed so much since that happened in two thousand and sixteen twenty seventeen that it would be really hard for a lot of these craters to kind of find that same level of success that they're finding from tiktok. And then there are questions with youtube is like. Can you make a ten minute, video like Can you, or are you going to get used to a whole new ecosystem? That is just two entirely different. The thing about tiktok is like it's super easy to succeed in your version of tiktok click, the side of tiktok you're on and whether it's like the dance, tik tok side of the cosplay tiktok once you're in it, you can build a decent following youtube, is much more harder to like break through. I find tyneside hundred six hundred account one of the actually one of the best singer to talk to you. Don't need to count to start watching it, but then it's so algorithmic, determines who you are, and it is just completely owned me like you're, like saint aubert, causeway takes out I've just like Grilling eyewash- couple guys reviewed screws like this?

payments kidding, I guess I m a senator Chris ran like what you think of the spruces like what's wrong with your takes up feed in that, but that's like an incredibly powerful little bubble that they create automatically right leg just instantly in automatically. It creates a bubble for you of your interests and that's why it's the best up, but we don't know how that filter bubble works. We know that. So media create those bubbles, can radicalized people really fast, like there's a whole level of stuff? We don't know about tiktok that tiktok out as a company with chinese influence somewhere and at its own by chinese bomber. It that that's not transparent. I don't understand it and then at next to mark Zuckerberg again who's about to testify in front of congress who constantly as things like either where this bigger the chinese companies when wouldn't you rather have me exporting american values around the globe. Don't worry about what I think those are Would you rather have that and have the chinese company encroach on america and how the chinese sacramento teenagers remarried? What to do and is a reasonably good argument regardless

things out. We're that's a good argument for him to make to our government and say, sat knocking me down because tik tok is here how that is going to play out, I think, is totally upside down, julie, I've seen a bunch of takes talkers say like why it. Doesn't get shutdown follow me and instagram in case it does it seems like their natural necks, is instagram, because the stories format but faced with, does have reels this other problem did your socking. That they roll it out, it is basically clone of Tik tok. Do you think that this has a moment, but I do think it can succeed at all, I think about it. If either you or deter someone at the verge had said this about when facebook had rebranded the logo, I think for instagram, and it said like instagram by facebook at that goes that moment, and it was like this is a dumb thing to do, because the best thing going for you is the fact that kids did it

your own by facebook? And I, like, I think about that, a law where it's like this is still a facebook, and I mean it act that in terms of whose per capita like what's back, what's up is on my facebook in their obviously extremely successful. But I think it's much harder either. For me personally, like I don't like using anything by facebook, it's just the thing I dont like doing, and I think instagram. Makes, sense of which is affecting instagram in terms of like how it works for influencers is very similar to how tik tok creators are currently kind. monetizing how their reaching audiences, like it still sponsor, based brand based and then it's much shorter and the the advantage to going to youtube. Of course is always the adsense like you can just make money off advertisements you're going to run, but it's undergoing so many changes. It's such a, hostile environment from legacy creators like when anyone new comes in their like very up in arms.

And they like go out of their way to make people feel and look nuts, and so I think instagram makes the most sense. I mean there's other apps like bite, which was founded by dom hofmann, who cofounded, vine and and bite could see some, but there is a surge. There was a reported surge in activity when they first announced that they were looking into banning tiktok and by dense sorry ups bite, which is not bite. Dance which owns tiktok by it's own separate thing, have told us that didn't have any. report the time, but it's an act that people could also flocked to have been looking for, something that is entirely new, where they can build a community and find that same kind of experience that they had on Tik tok. I'm looking like the extremely patriotic facebook reels commercials that are undoubtedly being developed, it very well when there is like flags away like this is, America's dancing app like it'll, be great. I'm excited about Russell. What happens next, I think this is

This is the thing with trump generally is he like makes line noise Something, and then you see if there's any follow through, so I think every is waiting to see if the white house actually does anything or hey just sort of find another shiny object he's gone way over this and fascinating this- is why I only have one guessed at a time now that we're gonna keep us, because we have to talk about training services the julie, alexander special, we'll take a break. We're back this episode, brought to you by shall define that's the sound of switching your business to shop, a fight, the global commerce platform that supercharged you're selling, harness the best converting check out and same intuitive features, trusted apps and powerful analytics used by the world's leading brands. Stop leaving sales on the table discover why millions trust shop, a fight bill, grow and run their business sign up today. For you

one dollar per month, trial period at shop, a fight outcome, slash tech, twenty three we ve all heard of. Oh, it's mistaken butter, diet that everyone from him garrison joe rogan to doktor Atkins himself, have tried and promoted, but here's something I never knew about kiddo. Turns out back in ninety ninety seven, none other than merrill streep made a movie based on a true story about a kid with epilepsy who was saved by the key die a gas turbines. We wanted to get to the bottom of this. What is kido water? key tones. What does all this have to do with saving people's lives? This episode the story of Cato you never knew some jane fonda buying gasp. Whenever you get your blood cast Julia, what what happened this week? What do I have to pay for this

it, maybe nothing at all so NBC universal, which, if new life you wanna do you're the Julia block. It's working. And we see universal is a minority investor. ask me knavish answered urge so NBC universal, launch. There will be fully launch their swimming service peacock, which is based on and disease famous bird now that the bird logo is anywhere on the app so they launch this fur across country. Originally they had launched a beta version of sorts in April for comcast customer, specifically so it's here, and it is the benefit to It- is that it's mostly free, it is like their whole play is that it is basically an advertisement kind of supported video on demand service. That is not going to cost you anything and you're going to get a bunch of cool things. If you don't mind dealing with

ads and its decent? It's like a decent service. If you are someone who really likes NBC shows which I do like, I grew up on them. It's a treasure trove of things to just watch for free in your house what she but like we it so the app is it's interesting. There's three different windows that you go in If you open it up on your tv, it's going to open up automatically into what they call browse, which, if you use netflix, if you use hulu, you already know what it looks like. It's the exact same thing, there's a bunch of rows that highlight some shows at the top and you kind of go through it, and then they separate into like movies tv shows, kids, the main thing, if you're on phone interim about, if you open it up, it brings you into a trending section, which I still understand what its four, but the idea is its these little clips, which

then be seen a vessel person told me think of unlike quick bites as if they had no, that is to say, but you basically scroll through, and it's like yours, I highlight from the city, show here's a highlight from sports leagues. Nbc universal installations in rates to here is like a piece of the celebrity gossip for the day we just kind of their social media window and then the most interesting part of peak peacock is the window. They refer to his chin. Knows what they essentially donors- we recreated the idea of linear television to anyone, uses cable when you up be another guide and you get to scroll through channels. Peacock hasn't recreated that with the exception None of very few of the channels are actually live, but what it does is it moves. The paradox of choice like it. If for people who are just like totally paralyzed when they open netflix they and apportion the same thing they ve been watching. You don't want to scroll through peacocks. Whole thing is like what, if you just wanted to watch a murder

mystery thing. What if you wanted to watch a sardonic asserted at live thing or jimmy fallon, you just click the channel in it automatically starts playing something which is very nice and, in my opinion, the future where a lot of these trimming services will go just because that paradox of choice. It is such a huge thing that they're all trying to figure out some minutes. It's here. It's like a dese, its it for what it is we're going to either spend no money at all, you're going to go completely free and get half of the kind of access to a lot of the shows, if you're, a comcast or cox subscriber you're, going to get it for you're gonna get the full use of the app for free and if you want to go completely ad free, it's either going to cost you ten dollars if you're, not a comcast or cox customer, or it's going to cost you five dollars so price wise. It's a big win. I haven't, I mean a trio max launched, it's a huge deal out of it. They send everybody, sweat peacock seems like a very quiet comparative to all of that other stuff. They sent us as a swag

that I am returning cause it's just. That We do, but they sent a pews projector. You gotta projector, and while I was like, I know it's leasing you could there is. I thought it was really funny, because it was like here's, what we're really highlighting on peacock and then they gave us projector and what their highlighting on peacock. It's like, shears, for those who are aiming to flake list requires the full projector skipper. If we can judge, I mean, there's a part of that. Desperately wants to do on streaming services launched by swag and like how Why is escalating like at the end of it? There? can send you a car or something, but I just meant in terms of like the marketing and launch in terms of the agency bought time warner, H, b, o. Is like the culmination of that deal right like they're like this is a Sure of time it is in this app and this is why eighteen t bought this company right, like just that.

Narrative around it was gigantic. The narrative round. Peacock is not. This is the future of comcast, or even this is the future of a it's a really interesting situation there, and so I sat down with their president of direct to consumer and we talked a little bit about this and I told him straight up that I thought it was a very defensive strategic play which is like we have to be in this space. So therefore we will have a streaming service, but peacock is to remind you that cable is good. Like peacock is there to be like head, you love life sports, we can only get them on cable or, like do you, love anything live or like anything, is happening in the moment. Have you considered, subscribing to cable, like that's very much how it reads: the only reason that I think it works as a straight upstream services, because NBC Universal, similar to viacom CBS, Their library of ip is just untouchable like it's, it's an insane amount of content that they're, like we own it all so we'll just we'll just put it on here, and so

you're, someone like me, who just wants to large like really old, shows all the time. It's a perfect service, because it's free- and it's like I as well just use, Instead of spending money on amazon, take buy stuff. For someone who is like the netflix, I think kind of person who I once knew every single week, which is what netflix does its there's not much to offer yeah so do we actually saying peacock exist and remind you that cable is good, like that's. Why conspiracy theory, because if you think of what a peacock is like they're kind of mean right, there's like big birds in their kind of agro- and I think is designed to make you feel bad about the absolute you go subscribe to. Cable round cannot just ass. Well, here infraction of peak, thereby they got these huge tails. Their mean, birds like burgess, mostly small and cute and chirpy, and these things are just like big and their colorful, but, like it's

proteids, designed to like Larry you in and to how we might so early in the morning. Dieter have like a zoo experience that he doesn't know what those people I know anything about millennials. It's that I know that they don't trust birds. It's true. There was in north oakland, an aggressive peacock that refuse to stop screaming and will made like now no news show I'm stopping this now anxious. You want to find out. You think me that russell and at some point in the future he will be backing. about a bird. Well, yeah there's another I'm just straight moving on a hard turn, but to two peacocks when I play will say, is well. I've been recording this I've been getting a lot of gems from a friend of the site box. Editor Allegra, frank who's, like I've been watching peacock all morning, what are you watching and she's like I'd? Just watching the today show- and I think makes for a lot of people-

the fact that you're going to have access to that kind of morning, talk shows and you'll have access to some live news, both from NBC and then from sky, which comcast bought years ago. in every analyst since then has been like. Why do you'll have some access to live news and I think for people who kind of just want, like random t v, and some lifestyle pico and again for that price. Peacocks is super, win, win, win for like comcast NBC and people who are going to watch. The opening price is zero. It's like that's, and that's such a nice when, when you compare each year max which is ten or any amount of money, bundled with any amount of thing right One commonality between peacock magnesium max is both of them are fighting ro coup with amazon seems like rogue, who is the far more agro player in this, like peacocks tweet, about amazon wrote to the amazon sweet was like. We are

gently working with our friends at amazon to bring into the platform we hope to have new soon, and there too, broke. It was like every but he harassed the official roku that literally used the word go squawk at roku, my life. My favorite tweet I've ever read. I brought it up with a kind of an expert. I talked to regularly know that you see this tweet and he without missing a beat just went no because nobody follows the peacock yeah, but yeah? So I mean this is my favorite fight? It's like. I have like push notifications for anything that happens with this, because I it's the the big fight that's happening is between the new entrance into the space, which are, max peacock, possibly more by their assuming services launch in the future, and then amazon an amazon rocky, basically control up around ninety per cent of how people watch tv- and there are still things no living rooms

so you want to be on their devices and, at the same time, peacock in Israel matter very big shipping services that amazon rogue, who would like to offer customers and the fight comes down to like nothing in media in silicon valley, access to data and money. Specifically, if we look at rogue who broke it takes a twenty percent cut of all sign up fees which might be less for big players like NBC, universal and warner media. But the other thing is the ad inventory, which basically means that when you have bring ads- and you have added- hasn't seen your plan- for which is a big thing for peacock rogue who takes the portion of that and they go cool. This is my now. Usually it's about thirty percent. The report from CNBC stated that it was closer to fifteen percent for NBC universal. The thing about peacock specifically, is NBC. Universal built this as like an ad platform

excel at it's like that was their whole thing. They built they built entirely new advertising technology for the streaming service, so they don't want to give up control of that they don't want to give up control of in app experience and roku is like well we're not giving up control of how much ad partaking that's a huge part of our business. It's like one of the biggest parts business and so they're in a stalemate, and then on the other end of it. You have amazon, which gets a little bit more complicated. But what it comes down to is that if you want to be on amazon fire tv, which is your real. What you use your device amazon wants these services to be a part of their channels, ecosystem, which apple also has an added version and born, or media and ambitious universal are going well. We don't want hbo max and peacock to be in the channels, and now there's this we're president were disney was able negotiate a weird deal. We're disney plus, is on amazon fire tv, but is not an amazon channels, and so the big fight is like. We want the deal that disney

as which is what hp, max's executive told you and I, when we interviewed him, he was like. We want the same deal that they're getting it feels like this fight is just going to break in favor of richard because they control so much like peacock cannot succeed on any metric unless they're on the roku platform and an amazon platform just because of how much just how much of Like smart tv stuff, they control how. How did why? Do they leverage back? What do they? Do you ever do a split on it. It's super interesting, usually people are like. Usually experts and analysts are very, like all one sided about these things. Everyone I talked to split every like there's, half the groups that say amazon in broken control. This argument, because their this distributors and the other half or like listen, NBC universal and feel o warner. Media is peacock nashville max it's their big streaming services that people action. One, it's a lot of ip that they carry. They are going to have shows especially h, b, o max that are going to be heavily talked about in the coming months and so to not have them is an interesting place for amazon.

broken his people will just go if you're me, you just use your playstation greatly guy just its. I use my passport for everything except gaming. So it's weird situation which would do what is funny is that now other companies are being asked about it like netflix, had their earnings call yesterday and they were asked about it in there I do you guys, think it what's going on with amazon. Roguish netflix is very much like we're netflix, so we're pretty happy with where we are live, We have really good relationships, please companies, but you know they were like you notice. It's a major laws for consumers and it's really sad to see play out. I think it's now coming to a head were. Hopefully deals will happen soon, but as well. So I mean that's like the. We should talk about netflix earnings, but the netflix first mover advantage. There is incredible, like you, if I was to put out a streaming box, the voxbox, let's call it which we should not do. It seems like a familiar but like, let's say

the vast box, and it does I'm netflix on it when we know it's dead on arrival, because that's the thing that most people definitely want an. Agnes, just has leverage baked in there just way ahead of the curve. It is impossible Is your max bid like most people, that we want to be a max fifteen dollars a month is like it also. Ethics is outside any add. So there's none of that drama in leverage to say we're not giving you we're not getting any. Or being your channels. Interface. Also we'd, like a button on your amount, here's dollar its like what tv needs is like an an open platform. That's neutral, Then you could just brows to the thing that you want letter box like I like, if like like a like a tv but with web on it like a web tv, is I didn't hear dieter here's one hears rebuilding its opens, stevie, straining bucks other just runs properly

I must also better- and I fully perfect it's. It's brilliant think. The conversation has shifted, yeah from last year two years ago, and it was like the streaming wars and the fight was like netflix verses. and now everyone you talked to, and what we're seeing very clearly is like it's netflix and sd. They both kind of made themselves very apparent that their foundational services, like they people, will switch devices. They will find ways to get these. Says on their tv or their de, they watch they watch everyone else's when you're into this kind of area, where they're trying to fight to be seen as a foundational service, and how are you seen as a foundational service, if you're not reaching seventy percent of people, the united states- and that is like the question that they have to figure out like into nato. Netflix spoke about this last night

it will under exact, as was like, we don't just have deals with a broken amazon. It's like every country that we're in we have great partnerships with device manufacturers, because we know how important that is, and they also now important. Netflix is like it's a really great position for them to be in an disney is kind of this: and to that where everyone wants disney on their thing, because people want disney, plus atrial max and peacock have to like prove that there are things consumers actually, I'm mass before any of the device manufacturers, are gonna, give any leeway silent. Ethics in earnings s, huge news, a new kosovo, so happy the most historically successful arrangement of executives, corporate history. What happened I dont, like try not to like you know, get really show vote agnes but surrenders was like this underdog executive and now these

Co writing running netflix with the like makes me so. People who ted surrenders said surrenders is the guy who made netflix the reasoning, you're subscribing to netflix he's their chief content officer and twenty while twenty thirteen he made a very gutsy move, and without telling his boss spent more than a hundred million dollars to bring house of cards to netflix between two thirteen, and now he is transformed that plugs into a place where you go to watch your shit. Favorite I'll show you I've missed on another network to you're going to networks because networks how's, your favorite, show they ve made it. He just he's you, the guy, who oversaw everything that happened with a regional series, original documentaries, movies and built that team, which is a power how seem of executives from hollywood and to making netflix in a kind of peter. Hollywood fan I have to do another julia box It's that calm as a netflix show called today explained the verge is working on a netflix show of which I'm one of the producers desert disclosure continue, Julia would story.

Just have this shit back. That's why you're starting to put it right, you're, a building into the sea, it s, because it's a Julia story, I gears five hundred words disclose. they are so yesterday they announced that they also have a couple of executive changes, but the biggest one is that ted surrenders is now co. Ceo with red hastings, not co, is very important because red hastings spent the open. Of his earnings call with analyse saying I am going anywhere? I mean it, you know, I mean it for the decade type a thing he has no plans to step down. He has no plans to stop working, but at the same time, in his blog post he odd netflix netflix is press website. He did specifically say this is part of like succession planning. So the idea is that, like he knows, he's not going to be there forever he's thinking of how to set things up. I think I have read on it, not that I have any incidences, but my read is that TED saranda is one of the most sought after executives in hollywood, this kind of can gives gives netflix the comfort of knowing that he

I believe, won't leave in the way that we saw at disney shake out when Kevin mayer left to go, run tick tock in part, because he was basically promised ceo and did not get it. So I think it was a very strategic move on netflix's part to keep a very important executive and from tents. Pretty I mean from from the content perspective in terms of what it means for us. You have the guy who it is Netflix's culture who created the idea of what a netflix original looks like now he's in more charge the company. He gets to be a little bit more public with certain things. So it's it's a good move, I think for netflix. Yeah that thing you're saying that having sought after if you're apple you're, like we had much more. Do you want us are office. Is a circle. Literally anything you'd want pike. What do you want? A circle office? We got one like If you want to see the next I found before it comes out, we can make that happen and like it's so you have to imagine. The other big companies are trying to push him because he is he's the guy who can do it needs instant credibility.

so I m not move, seem smart. It also seems like that red hastings that existing scione. Kosovo has not had as much influence and the contents right he's been. this strategy side, the technology side? That's all It makes sense. How do you think that relationships and play out, I think it's gonna, be what they're doing now I mean, I think, the the you know the whole joke about ted like not telling reid. He was spending one hundred million dollars at, like you know not early netflix his career, but that is not not in the last five years, which is when they've really kind of person to the scene as the streaming giant, but just going like I'm going to spend this money, because I think we should have house of cards making an unprecedented deal in hollywood, which is giving an order for two seasons of a show which never happens I don't like David fincher of starting so very early on being like we're going to have these connections to talent. I think just go. Greed has trusted him, since that, like it's just been like ted, seems to know what he's doing.

Which is like a position that a lot of other executives did not think of ted sarandos netflix first started. They were like no idea what ted's doing, but netflix seems cool, and so I think it just makes sense and also read, can focus on growing the business internationally, which is what they're now big thing is going into the next decade and he's going to focus on on figuring out how to strategize him and continue building and finding new subscribers in places where like at this point, the joke is, if you don't have netflix, why we think you're not going to have netflix, because you probably have it by now. well. His thing is trying to find new subscribers, which they've done a remarkably good job of in the last six months and the last since in Q, one and q two they amassed twenty six million subscribers in all of two thousand and nineteen. They amass twenty eight and so they are doing very good. Throws also warning every investor. This will not last so just just prepare for that.

he's focusing on unmaking the company, even bigger than it is you're. Probably gonna hit two hundred million by the end of the year, which is a huge number he's worrying about competition from disney My favorite thing he said last night was occasionally Isn't he has a hamilton which is a great way just describing that relationships he's so focused on where the streaming industry is getting heading in the next few years, it's only gonna get bigger and more and more competitive that having ted to just run the company at a point and be like I'm only going to focus on ensuring that we have the best shows and building out franchises building out ip is a place that he's happy to be in,

Alright, we gotta take a break there's a little bit of xbox news to talk about who we are back. Imagine you call a cab and it pulls up to the curb in front of your place and you get in and you look over the driver and there is no driver they're, just robots, hello, I'm johnny cash. Where can I take you tonight? What's going on? It feels unsafe, but then the robots like come with me. If you want to live, and so you relent and all of a sudden, the robot makes the cargo and you actually get to your destination. But then the robot gets kinda sorta get out what sounds like a distant sci. Fi future is now a reality. Robo cabs are picking up passengers in san francisco and they're coming for you next hunted eggs

I am. You lie patel editor in chief of the virgin host a decoder podcast. This number on taking over one of the new posts at the code conference. Said CNBC Julie, abortion in case he knew from platform and hard work. you ve heard us all talk to major players in the world of tech and business on our shows. But code has live unfiltered journalism, you won't find anywhere else

this year we have on sage interviews with ex such twitter ceo window, yet reno microsoft see tee o kevin Scott and many more from a height streaming platform shifts to privacy. No one knows exactly where we're headed, but code is where the world's most influential people come together to find out. Join us for the start of a new era, apply to attend the code conference now vocs media dotcom, slash code, that's vocs, media dotcom, slash code will see you in September Due to ban yeah, I just I'm looking at these links and I run down how many howdy axes are there in our rundown ex my suit. Fully out of control. what is going on and they made more xbox announcements trees. You literally can't go a week in twenty twenty without there being three xbox announcement that ok try, give it a shot tomorrow and talk to phil spencer

They are going to bundle in x cloud, which is their game streaming service with xbox game pass ultimate in september. They're gonna rename it, points and they may change it in the future. Such that you'll be able to stream other exe ox, games beyond the stuff. It's included in x cloud. The thing that were to come back to hear is the interesting thing about ex crowd, as it works great, an android and then added So there is a game on the iphone one came. You have pulled out who actually it's now literally that's all they can do, because I think that if they add the ability to stream multiple game an apple will consider it a competing game store and they will get banned, and so they make the only way they will be tested on the iphone that was have one game available is like the halo game and that's what you get on the app store, and so there, ongoing negotiations of will

I phoned allow third party game, shaming services or non and know the anthea. What what is it? What's the controversy? No, they will not unless you pay them, thirty percent, that's the sir? I I mean I guess I don't know I mean they they ve, they have cut sweetheart deals like we know because we are deals, hbo would have cut sooner deals with microsoft over office like they exist. But who knows it's like apples interest till I have any competitive apple arcade in this moment. and apparently not doing so well, he hasn't it I assume that apple arcade has been used by men at work. Ahead of us is so good at the start, and then they think they just didn't keep up occasions. A games which is a real bomber, but. That initial thing I was so bully over it I loved it, and then Additionally, we found out that xbox three x will be the play, basically any xbox game, as long as the extra came doesn't require connect because connects fully dead. It means that the last piece of the original xbox one

I are blaster. Dream is finally dead. I told you so what does this mean for people who use connects to power? There tvs lakes, like the they like asked, convinced, biologic tech, harmony, remote, because that's going to be supported for now. I think microsoft has just walked away fully from the idea that you're going to control other devices export trade. Does a series acts have any voice control that we don't know yet actually done something. I would bet the controllers- have microfinance in them- are: whenever repetition, central living room dream, which makes us dreams for thirty years, seems to just be gone by fair. Like we're data, and they're so mad about that dream dying that they decided to make the xbox a giant refrigerator? I learned that you have to have a little you're living room as like revenge. We gotta go what they are doing. A we make. People know that microsoft is in the living room, it'll be fuckin huge,

I showed my my brother he's. Not u engineer, I showed him. The xbox was a xbox series, accept an xbox his acts? Excellent, and I showed him that and he was like he was always like what kind of soundbar but yeah it's amazing, and then lastly, the xbox one x and the xbox one s digital edition. Have discontinued, do you can still by a xbox one s. that? Eventually, you'll be other bio xbox series acts and we are anticipating. There will be an x serious acts, digital addition, other may be called an xbox series s unclear tbd, who is naming any of these things, but I think the sort of running conventional wisdom here is that game console sales went ticked up a little bit since, because of the pandemic, and microsoft had already been winding down production.

On these councils, and so they just like who ran out or are running out and a thick well, ok, we could make more or we could throw our weight behind the new thing. That's coming this fall, and that is that that I think that's just it. So if you, if you want to buy an xbox d, because you should wait for the series ex slash whatever happens to the rest of the platform there. What a hard problem, yeah right like there's a demand, and you don't want to service it because you want people to wait. But if you sell somebody a wake of what xbox one x is like. Four hundred bucks, five hundred bucks right- expensive view by that there's no way or buying a series x in the fall I think they're, just taking at the high end see one astrid by two hundred bucks. Whenever it is, and then you might still by serious acts. merkel to me as they hung up.

The regular one s with the drive and they they got rid of the digital edition, which is fascinating. I I would have expected that to be flipped, but I also hate spinning disks. You know so I dunno I I bet they just stuck with whatever is the cheapest, like whatever is the cheapest of the highest It is right to want it. They make them ass well, but it's cheaper to make something about a spinning desk than with dyke, literally they did was take the thing out of the box out. How much is one dvd drive cars? Can I understood They made a whole video like how are we going to make a digital edition and then let the whole video is just them admitting that they just pulled the dvd drive out up. And then it's just the simple running is part of the people. Buy more games cause they're, just stories like five games and yes, like diamonds like internet america's, great, that's, fair, and then Will there be more xbox announcements every week until the end but there is literally one coming up. I think next week, unlike the twenty third or something so stay tuned for yet more came announcements. Vienna. That's just how

works, and then I guess we should mention. I think, there's a rumor that a pretty well documented that the playstation has like radically ramped up ps five production like they're they're, making more than they originally planned, like they're. Getting ready for big big large kimberly. E3 was sport is now ether is one month and ships, colleagues, its economic and monetary affairs is just like it's like it's just a little bit every week for all of time now. Sometimes I just checking with our games at her and drew up stern than friends at the sight of pollyanna mike how you do it in its leg, explicitly persist, but much of what we ve done way over actually not so bad. It's like a medium amount of over, but it's definitely over Julia. Thank you. Thank you Russell, my friend, thank you yeah yeah, thanks for having do you have any thoughts on netflix warrior. Not I would say this. Is it the question by locking down warrior? None netflix is like

in short, and so, if you get a rogue device that doesn't have warrior known like way. Where are you now Doing Julia. I have an idea for a pop up pike ass. We rather way, which is just every week you, say the things that disney plus is censored on it's service. I I start I've literally started and accept people just send me stuff there like there's no button. That's the key is to me saying alright. That said versa this week. Thank you for listening, it has a newsletter yep. It's been, it's been about a little hiatus and I'm also taking a vacation later this week. So it's it's intermittent, but it still exists at first dot com, slash newsletter. This is the worst call to action ever The new do I to make a little about of comes, our seas are casey newton and enzo shiver have the interface, which is great as version com such interface.

We'll be back on tuesday, with the interview episode kim setter here to talk about security issues. It's gonna be pretty good. We're going to have a little security focus role that we we we banked a bunch of episodes on that on that topic, so excited for those to come out and we'll be back next week, party soon wear masks.