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last episode before the midterms we turned to the Democrats. Take a lesson Hmm. Hi, my us that Herndon I'm a reporter with the new york times. I was looking for Delaney me. I thank you so much I'm calling because I host our politics podcast caught the run up and we were hoping the five two minutes for us to chat right now. accorded for a possible use in our pockets is at our meeting. We do yeah, I guess at the uk some interesting cool budget so much on the first hour ass, a basic stuff. Just where do you live in How old are you I lived in gothenburg and on twenty four years old? Berger, I pennsylvania when you look These mid term elections is, issue or or a set of issues that matter to the most

Yeah I mean he's gone policy and an abortion laws are, are pretty important. I think also, that we found our school and honestly, just you know, having politicians that aren't dick bags you're, a young person I mean. Have you always been interested in politics? Have you always voted since eighteen, I'm curious of how interested in politics you are I'm not super interested. I haven't always voted when it against trumpet Biden? I dont think I voted because to me honest I had my family, what my parents, telling me that tromp was like way to go and he was the best and they would give me money if I voted for it oh yeah yeah they

me they would pay me like fifty bucks, if I went to vote for trump and finally that didn't work telling me no. it didn't work, but they also were passed really bad about binding and that he would like being mine, controlled and that like a whose, whose the vice president now Turning a cobbler harris come here Also telling me that the whole reason for them getting Biden elected was so that she can take over. And that she would ruin the country and it I dont now just a whole bunch of crazy stuff. So I decided to stay out of it completely democrats used to brag about their grassroots voter coalition

the obama ere. They had good reason to fear I base and led by young people, minority voters and college educated women. It was to carry the party for a generation, but in twenty sixteen that coalition began to crack. When some of those voters stayed home and even more so in two thousand and twenty, when some of them back trump and now facing a hardened republican party, that's unified in its vision for the country. The democratic party is try to re energised its base before it's too late today, in part to the lost democrats in their own words from the new york times. I must

that Herndon, this is the run up There's a couple of things. I wanted to ask you about that specifically motivated young people allow around the last two three years of a curious how you saw it. What did you think about the the protest in two thousand and twenty. Was. That was that there was at the white house, one I'm talking about the George Floyd moment where there was a lot of protests all across the country right Are you asking, like anything, specifically dislike what I thought about the thing and the innocent guess. I'm asking that those moments influence if any, how you saw Biden or tromp or politics. It's kind of a tough one. I dont think I really thought much about the present

when that was happening. I was thinking more about the individuals involved in the protests, and from the really bad things that happened and. Yeah, I don't know it did not make me think of all the president. Did this that, and that was horrible and then we'll about january sixth, did you follow any of that? Maybe can you ever my memory? You know there was the folks who storm the capital. After between in between tromp invite in getting elected. I wonder if that hit your radar. Eighty out, there it did my parents who tried to bribe me to vote for tromp. They were there oh alter they were there. Yes, in like support of trauma, then everything it. one idea yuck, it was lucky I do not like that that happened. I I just don't I didn't

we would like any of the things that they were doing and why I days had a lot to do with you. Why I don't follow their. Nickel views I dont align with them at all, as it has not changed any. Have they got more political, have they gotten, but they always like this. As you were growing up or has that distance grown between EU aid think they were like this when I was younger, but obviously one eye super little, I wouldn't have been paying attention to it, but I don't know that They definitely gotten worse with can't. You know. One of the things that Joe Biden has tried to say is that even people who are not that political people like you, will have to become. More motivated in this moment, so they could save democracy, so things like the six would never happen again. Does that message resonate with you?

mean he he's kind of asking someone like you to become more political action, didn't you. I wasn't even aware that he'll I came out and basically said that, but it does make sense to me- and I think, should the also billion should be more involved in politics and see it as like. Their voice does matter, but I don't know we also have a real hard time agreeing on he thing and the people who really loud? Are the people like my parents, who are extremists and They'll go to the ends of the earth, to tell you that you're wrong in what you believe is stupid and then everyone hearing that gets super defensive in a just causes, fights so I dont know howard poster.

Together and agree on stop and make certain things happen. I don't I'm probably getting off topic from what you have another and I think that's interesting for you is there are like a word or a person or a place, you, to where you find your news, that you trust a lot of time at ted. I don't really trust any new channels on I hate to use this term, but It is kind of like fearmongering the people, that who watched the news, all the time are really paranoid and terrified of everything, and they get all this. information just repeated to them over and over and over again from multiple different new channels. I would rather get information. and from people who have some. Our views to me or views at all,

What challenge my views on with like facts and information. That may be, I didn't know about you know I'm I'm always willing to. In my opinion, is it makes sense and is its real? You know. The last thing I would ask is like arm. I mean. describing that, like people on the sidelines have been apathetic, while your parents, two dont really agree with had been more motivated in politics, but at the same time you say you're, not it don't seem like completely sure that you're gonna vote in november. I Well, you know like how do we? How do we reconcile all of those things If you, if you feel apathetic people, haven't really gotten involved, but you seem to be yourself not really fully getting involved and say, doesn't apply to you too. I guess the fighting

man- I don't know the fighting it someone's screaming at me about their opinion. Like I just drop out of the conversation it's no longer interesting to me to fight with them. So if I have to fight with you, ray single thing that a politician stands for. I'm not interested in that. I dont want to argue with people I want to be able to sit and have normal com stations where people are Ass willing to take in new formation new opinions, but I guess my experience has been that people with opposite views of me. really really angry when others don't agree with them, and I and probably the opposite of extremists on. So I guess that part of the reason I stay out of it. What,

it's going be the determining factor on whether you decide to are you. We are going to vote or not vote or you're waiting for something to know. I'm just trying to make sure I don't misrepresent that hm hm hm I think I think we will probably try to go about. I think maybe it would be good for us to look at it options a little bit better and opinion on it. So I think I think we'll try to I think I think it would be good for us to try. This is kind of bynum good reminder for me.

The. hi my name's instead Herndon I'm a for the new york times. I was looking for nelson aquino tino Aquino, I'm so sorry about that. How I know how you I'm doing well, I guess, when the start, with some more basic questions, just tell me about what you do and where you live, I'm an item The manager and I leave and sent a foreigner. Ok, have you consider yourself? A democratic republic in historically democratic thought, we're! Ok, when I was your first democratic well. What's your origin story with the democratic party man, I'm trying to think back well. I think I want to identify more with it after I got out of the military, which was, I want to say two thousand and six, so I guess my first,

major vote would have been for obama in two thousand and eight, but I was just getting out of the military. I was twenty something years old and I don't think there's any eighteen or nineteen year olds, they're thinking politics seriously, so I'm not for the most part. Anyway, but once I got out of the military, it got me thinking about more our role in the world and how are about expects it so that I could have done more involved in it and at that time. What led you, when you were doing that type of thinking to to the democratic party a blog? I want to prepare that. I think, because what It was more when nine eleven happened. You know everybody was super gun. I and listed in the military, you know it was a very somber but crowd moment for us to come together. After you know, the initial adrenaline rushed from book, it was more like you thought, seeing all these you know, I don't call him mistakes worth spending started, dropping more and more justification for it

owing to Iraq and all those things start piling up and about kind about a different taken things outside the fact that you know it was a historic vote, first of all but policies were more realistic? There have been other black handed before that, nobody can put them seriously right not to his level, but is because he was talking with substance, and how did you I mean Did you feel at that time, once he was able to win? How did you feel a day. What was your sense of the country when that happened? I felt that there was hope. I felt that this experiment of democracy, that we have that you know that the change in demographic does affect the event people following their vote in matter, but it did

we wanted to have an african american president and we felt that it was historic and not just that it would be a good candidates overall, which I think is more important. Now there was hope we can change that. We wanted to that kind of what that overall feeling was for me. How did you still feel that were about democracy her I want to, but I can't say that I did not greatly diminished at this point just because of how the environment is today When did that start to change for you winter? That hope, for you start to fade into that deep sigh or it wasn't, went trump got elected it was it It was it wasn't when he got it, it was after I mean when starts ignoring congress, and now it's you know, you're defying a subpoena when it came time for democrats denominated challenger tromp, who did you

support. I like burning, I like, and you yang biting, wasn't my first choice as I think democratic or too soft and everything we have to push a stronger kinda. Did you always think Democrats were too soft? I mean it doesn't sound like it. I know they weren't too soft for the times, but today the they are when when, when did that Indeed, that shift for you. When did you start wanting more from Democrats now like without of patriotism? Part like republicans are the owners of patriotism and you think that their defining treat to them by their beliefs and if you don't believe what they believe you're, not patriotic, which is bs, like republicans pro gun pro life, whatever those kind of standards are then I bet into either patriotism or religion and if people believe in

the things you're, not a patriot or you're, not religious. There has been a really effective job and you don't have democrats that come back and challenge those points You know, I don't think they do it in a way that resonates with people to understand that they are also patriotic. sounds like you want democrats to have like a rallying uniting cars? don't really see them having right, it'd, be centered around religion or a specific thing, but it it's just something that resonates with people that would kind of overcome those like I could be a christian and and be pro life or pro choice or pro gun or anti gun. I don't have to be a christian and have to be pro life and have to be gun? You know one of the things we talked about on our show. Is this exact thing about how republicans have used idea is a religion of patriot I'm too really unite their voters. What

challenges that Democrats have. Is they just have more different types of voters? They're china unite people across a lot of different types of races, a of different crops of classes, different educational background. What do you think they could say that would we bring all those different type of disparate groups together. on one set of priorities- and I think people are tired of the way the system is- and I think if there was a candidate- and I would say that if there was a candidate from any party that said the system is broken, I am and to do away with the electoral college, I'm going to do rank twice body. I am going to paternalism on congress to term limits on the supreme court like a systematic change where most people can agree. I think that person would go a long way if a Democrat did that then great

what I think systematic changes required and I think more people are fed up with the system than they are with their actual policies. So, if you wanted something more substance, that Democrats can bring people together on those are things that are purchased, democrats and republicans and independents alike I mean I gotta tell you, I hear so much about democrats trying to The singular issue in the traditional sense that can unite these groups, I'm here from you is like it's not an issue is the fact that all of these groups feel like the system is working right of all these other underlying factors like gerrymandering and did the redistricting and all the other things that it's not working for everyone. or the majority of people, because we we we make. It seem like one hundred per cent of us have to breathe and it's never going to happen. Vs we get the majority of us to agree and and that's the direction that we moved because that's in essence democracy. The majority should rule

um yeah. I think the majority would feel in in the in the conversation that I've had with republican friends and family is fine. Let's not talk about abortion, let's not talk about, gun control, never thought about any of that. How do we fix the system? to be more serving to the people. Ok, Ninety percent of americans agree that background checks are sensible. Why isn't done nine percent of us that include a lot of Republicans yeah. That's a system question: that's not an issue class that you're a systemic question, so wise and done it. Maybe percent of us agree on it. That's a systemic question: how do we fix offers them? Remove lobbying from congress? Make campaigns publicly funded, move personal interests the stomach issue, there is a lot of democratic right now who are focusing on other issues like I did in Kosovo that things that come up and we talk about republicans- is there very upset about If democrats have talked about

like raise issues like gender and throughout things like that, I mean they use that as a dividing crutch or a rallying call for their base right, and there are some things that I think are especially when it comes to like the gender identity kind of things that we have to look at as democrats and say: okay, There's one thing: if you want you want to: I don't know this is inappropriate say, but if you want to identify as whatever you want identify, as I respect that, but you can't make me identify you have that right, like especially when that clear cut like want to identify as a billion dollar playboy in on you know, four seven in one or two pounds and balding lake identify but it does mean you're. Gonna call me that you know what I mean. Do you feel like a party it too much on cultural again, I think it's, I think those kinds of things are just distractions as far as how we behave as a society of people will get used to it.

And whether we have two bathrooms or four bathrooms or three but like whatever the case may be, whether it's? How sports participate that we'll figure that out to where it feels fair for us, but that's something that government and we shouldn't really be focused on. We have much bigger fish to fry. But, as a democrat like there are real numbers that show you know violence against trans? Can these that show the need for education. Around gender in sexual identity how'd, you ballads those realities with the feeling, You seem to be expressing that talking about those issues has maybe some other things that you find more pressing on the side won't know I'll say this is education in regard to it to make people. it. I'm totally! Okay with that, and I think that should be something that it is just like how we started doing education on race forty years ago that the stock gonna take time. But when you're spending time on a debate stage talking about

this? It's taking away from more important issues, and I think that a big is right now than that, and I think we have to prioritize those first and that bigger threat is challenges to the system. Right, okay, okay, let the last questions I have look ahead like in these midterms. What are you looking for? Hoping for? You have a big race in florida, very pessimistic, it simply because of the level of misinformation there is. The truth has been skewed so far that now you you can't make an informed decision, especially if you're not keeping up with it. Like. I consider myself someone that keeps up with without if a lot, but I'm not the average person, I don't think

and if the average person can't find information quickly and make a determination about what their beliefs are and whether they agree with the candidate, then then it just becomes that much easier to manipulate them into making the wrong choice in voting against their own self interest, and I think that's what's happening now I mean, if you are both pessimistic about where the system is an pessimistic that democrats are going to be able to fix it in november. Where does that leave you for the look ahead for the future depressed yeah? I I think it's in cycles. I think, if I hope with well, I hope that it doesn't get to a point where there is more violence Anders bigger threats, that get a handle on it and we can kind of take a step back off that cliff, but

The devil is standing on the edge of it and that kind of my feeling right, like it's actually gonna, take but more publicans like with changing to say, look, it's not whether I agree with them a crash enough. This is wrong and even if it costs me, feet. I would vote for her heart because she's literally telling me I don't care about not the power. I care about doing what right I hear that, but because it cost of her see like I have a hard time see jamie as an example of of hope, because doing that she has lost her credibility with Republicans right yeah. But that's the thing if they just want to tell you wouldn't want to here, then

not the right fit for you, I'm you people have to figure that out. Eventually, I guess right. I keep coming back to that list. You talked about the eye. What what's the extra? I don't know? mm. I really, I really don't know I think I'm I I wanted. I would wanna say it's a Democrat that comes forward and kind of set things straight, but I think it has to be someone the republican party has enough waiting to bring people back to their senses because them Wiki bearing down this path. I don't even dynamo. Oh yeah We ended up with, and I dunno, if we're going to jump or not hm hm hm hm hm hm hm right back, here's what's trending! Now you can defer paying

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I'm a I'm. Hi, my name's instead Herndon I'm a reporter from the new york times. I was looking for catherine. Thank you so much for picking up I am our host of our politics. Podcast cause the run up and we ve been calling people to try to get this of how their feeling about politics heading in to the mid term elections. If you have like ten minutes first, a chat: do you think we could do so Savona, yeah, that's one thing: So much while I first with just love to know more about you, where are you in the country how old, are you and what you do for a living I wouldn't in I would have been the descent honey, often area. I am thirty. I'm a graphic designer. How would you describe yourself to someone who's never met you all. I am. I think I am. I am queer,

identify as non binary, but I am politically clocked as the woman and have that experience growing up. what did you grow up in texas, yeah, your mental life? I grew up in an extremely liberal family, which is really surprising and obviously yeah yeah, and you ve always consider yourself. A Democrat were given the option there. I'm running far far much further details. then most democratic party, but that's gonna, where we're out right now, you know Texas is obviously notoriously concert, and has long for a long time taken pride in that on the state level, as one who has spent their life in texas, did you consider going elsewhere

I I have, and I'm a lot of my feelings about that are going to be determined by the next election, because you know I I'm in a situation where, at this point I'm actually questioning my safety and certainly the safety of my friends. You know there's kind of a run of us, worried and making exit plans. If we have to It's hard because there there's a lot about macros that I love and admire. Texas is an absolutely gorgeous state to live in, but I think you know I it's not a good time.

Really it's you know with roe v wade and the just serious extreme anti women's than men as far as reproductive health, I'm just on that level alone. It's really frightening and then counting the fact that probably forty per cent of my friend bertrand and the anti trans sentiment across more of the smaller town had gotten actively more hostile. Would you trace that too? I I one hundred per cent trace it to trump. Okay. I think it was always there, but I think, trump being elected and running on the platform that he did it gave people license to be more vocally off. I you know it it. I I am not as visibly affected. Most people are not going to look at me and guessed anything about me lgbt wise, but I have a lot more

friends who are and trying to figure out how to explain us and we have to sit down when we're going to go out in a public place. That is nonsense done on San Antonio is pretty fine most of the time it's fine. But if you go outside of san Antonio, any of the around it. You gonna you kind they plan. You have to have contingency plan through what happens? If somebody decides it, half the with you, you have to have a sort of practice. The escalation techniques as it is, is that what you be my plans, you practice those the escalation techniques that sort of my approach and no other. people who have different approaches and better more combative, work more based around just avoiding situation. The birthplace, my go too, is to try and

call calm the situation down, but it's not fun. You trace the the change in this kind of palpable sentiment back to donald trump. I'm curious as to what you think about Democrats. Have they counter sat effectively, candy counter them I think I think more than anything, my frustration. A Democrats have been a desire to him. surely play night with people who are very determined to not make out an option agonizing back. Michelle obama, and that when they go, though we go high and the problem I have with that sentiment is that it gives legitimacy to claims that are not acceptable and there has been waiting room pushed back on rhetoric of that level.

And I think it lightly getting better. I think there's finally been from understanding that you can't like there's a group of people in this country. That is gotten way louder and weigh more aggressive that you just had hot argue. Were you cannot reason? Was you cannot somehow being nice enough and make them understand and want? to work with you at this point. In my life, I've seen enough people who it there is no arguing them into a kind of state of mind. There is no arguing them ensue, understanding of a group of people that they they don't want to understand, showing showing that you Willing to recognize that that's not a viable path for it. Any more is massive and getting people in my give a graphic on your site. How do you balance that desire for

not compromising when it doesn't make sense or cutting republicans out when it doesn't make sense, with the reality for democrats needing to win a particular ballad, and I think we don't compromise the people who tried to overturn the election. Think that's a big start, but you could argue that, under that umbrella falls a big chunk of the republican party. Currently, I think you have to really that's terrifying, but there is not an answer or where tolerating a complete disconnect with reality. Does anything good, because the shift to the right just the way we are not caressing, we just keep moving as a country where the right, when we tolerate five

oh well jokey and the glp was not always that way. Okay, but what let me ask it differently? What would it look like to not tolerate that stuff? I get that republicans can vote them out and they haven't in primaries, but like what would it look like for Joe Biden to not tolerate it? What would it look like for democrats to not tolerate it. I think, honestly, it's been getting better, I'm not a my way or or by calling out the instructions for what they were as much as it made a lot of the glp angry. I think that was really necessary. I think there's a lot. I will The more I put on the ground effort from the democratic party at large to reach out to people who are turned off by what on the job here, because there are significant numbers of people who have left the party. I'm ok with

There is an ideological different there and I am willing to show that in philby, current right wing nationalist uprising is pushed Where is the one you're willing to sell your differences with people until though trump winged over publications are cut out? Why that were important common right Well, this rising tide of right wing nationalism is actually terrifying for huge swaths of the country and as much as I am super leftist duper progressive have really strong ideal, but it is vastly more important to me that that go away and not have a place where it is a part of everyday american politics than it is for me to get everything

I want right now, but would not require de prioritizing for lack of a better word like algae bt issues. I think when you're looking about certain things, probably yeah I mean- I think, there's room so still talk about them and try and like full people understand but is also different between pay. Maybe we are focused on creating national protection for elderly people and are just focused on not creating. Was that directly harm and attack of ten years to that point? When we look ahead, like it's a good chance, the results don't go your way, not just at least in texas, but even if the Democrats do find a way to hold on their not looking a great prospects to be able to provide protection.

four algae bt communities to be able to codify roby weighed in law, things that are tangibly important? to your life in the people around these life. What, then, is your prospect for the future? I mean if it is like this now, where do you think it's going? Now, at this point, it is thinking too much about what could happen is though, overwhelmingly terrifying that parallel paralyzing, because I really think that the worst is a situation where the majority of the country has no voice, and there is no good outcome from that. If it doesn't come to that

level of bad? If we just sort of continued a muddle along, I think there is a chance that if we fight hard nothing long enough, we will be able to pull the country back into some semblance of understanding that diversity is good and allowing people to live their lives with some amount of freedom is good. I don't know, though, and I dont like speculating, because there's not a lot of options, but I see that have me hopeful. The most helpful thing in there is fight hard enough and long enough, and I don't want to live in that world, but that's kind of the world that we're facing hm,

Hmm, the my name's. Instead Herndon, I'm a reporter with the new york times. Is this ratio. I thank you for picking up I think we talked earlier this summer here. Thank you for picking up again a lot to learn more about you than we did last time. You just tell me like where you are in the car. I see what you do for a living? Just tell me more. pennsylvania what part my family's from pittsburgh my mom's side and then wilkes barre, okay, okay, how long Therefore, I have been out here almost five years now: oh okay, so you're not you're, not from wilkes barre I'm originally from new york, okay, long island, what brought you there? I'm the rent prices and

I was in schools were much better than they were in new york. I came out here because, through better, call me well the movement of pennsylvania. A move to join you, ok light. Is it. Is that again because of opportunities, I'm curious why, Go ideas because prices? Ok, First moved out here I got for four bedroom for seven. Fifty, margaret informal drifting anchored in the thing out. I'm working single mother trying to survive in this world is howard very hard, because every time you think you can just a little bit about water drown you again, we either building insulation, something Aren't you away to break the people where we tested gate

the EU set your mother, how many children I have three children. Have a son that nineteen daughter it is about the be seventeen next long? Then I haven't, the daughter? That's gonna be twelve. When new have thought about politics. Have you typically voted for Democrats? no, I really just gotta go into politics within the past five years, because I m a fund. As you know, the way you have to live for somebody else. You know you gotta, look towards the schools and the community and stuff like that. It takes a different look on the when you think a world well, let me then start before that stuff. Are you not voting originally before that? Before five years ago. Now you are voting. Ok, why weren't you voting wasn't voting, because I didn't believe in that country. when the government at all I really don't buy. I can see how will you don't work?

things can really change. Well, let's take something like brock obama. action in two thousand eight you set that election out here that was a big moment where people talking about things like hope change. You are moved by that now because I know it was a letter for its help. How did you know at the time I'm curious. They know the eastward medical they want them We gonna put that black man in me and will lead to a minor change. They wanted Let me think about everything that may be blocked every case be good you gonna, where you get donald trump and everytime, you turn around me back a little garden is back in a minute. I don't get it. lebanon, nobody we re the. Why I'm body they hear for Joe Biden me, is tat. We get outrageous images really begin the lesser of two evils. That's only then, let's just deal with democrats for a second,

They sent me all the time that there, the party of the working class right that they our prioritizing people like single mothers that they trying to create economic opportunities for people of color? What about that general message? isn't translating to your day to day life go along with the wedding been ever been doing it, I believe, black mothers? I've been around since the beginning, the time why nobody been held my nobody, everything they keaton about the same thing, they went unnoticed. Government started open. A pink helping. People, we have. Even comes to awaken untidy thick. I'm still awaited we know about. I open the people really good. I mean literally, like I said, I've repeated and thirty six one

was younger. I couldn't take it Might I add the word to just go to school and I couldn t forget you: why did you take it with any we're from twenty to twenty dollars at that time, and I would like ten years ago way at that I was only making minimum wage was to imagine having a child going to school and you're gonna pay almost one hundred dollars in child you how we do it Quite literally, I wish the politicians, when we put the picture that they give us as he how we do it. Ok, I get your point about the economy and Democrats not doing things touch people like you. What about we move on from the economy, but if our issue is about race, identity, culture, representation. Democrats would say that there is a lot of reasons for someone like you should support them, not just

the economy worrying. What's it responds to that that even at the party can provide a better livable lifestyle for you better economic opportunities for you, but they can provide. Is you know to not be as racist republicans as what they would say? No, it's not possible number one we'd, only big knowledge that racism can exist in amerika. We still can the blind eye like dinner there, so that market I had been deadlock in the change when people stop lying and tell the truth. Racism is real. Racism is in every part of america, but nobody's gonna. Think we got there. Back in the buggy running around to unlock the ip blade, wouldn't talk about political raised, their replies, which I'm talking about critical about somebody else's, Why were you in order to say that I haven't figured out

I doubt whether he had a large teach people not to be racist in theirs was crazy, don't go to college daylight in elementary. I was put out because I was younger. You can't hide from the truth. You can't hide from reality. I don't know. I would like. Our children are growing up like they're gonna stay baby for ever You're! The only thing is that we always world. I don't know anything about the world. They parents won't let them up, but the world because they think is where little nice people bubble know you The only true like we got a lot. Know where racism is not going to stop during the crash they could problem with that to the Democrats but what they think I'm gonna help then that everybody bed

we know about america and anyone that says to help black people is not going to fully have begun. Give us a good mouthpiece but they're, not helping I'm not ignorant to this country, but you did vote for Joe Biden in two thousand and twenty do you think Devo has been worth it? Looking back like, I said it was just nonetheless, the two there would be no by writing by opening up in an even bigger Why is it that old, something you look at it? You got the governor, fighting? Does the government to help the government you've did they were banned by the republicans by the president? weirdo fuck. Are we the people supposed to be intimate the warlike? Ok because the question that looks ahead are going to vote on these midterms terms, awaiting boy and his world. We don't know towards possible, but ok

Then let's just slow this down, though a second you're saying you will vote in these may terms, and you will vote for democrats because its emergency, but you aren't really happy about that vote because you don't think that democratic do much for you in that. If republicans, when you think what republic away Are we going to war? There are many say today and that in germany they did in a they don't get their way we're going to war, but either way What did you learn sandy we're getting where wherever the happened, they said they were going to do it all is tat people, what they're going to do and nobody gets taken serious. That's the problem the only done they really started. Talking about how bad, though, red or again how bad the breadth of didn't when I bought a going against the down when it

I'm going to get paid the things they want me when you started but amc and when it bob, I ain't you might think, along with other members wall, I'm literally thinking that I couldn't go outside to people houses and why? About the guy you yeah literally it past as war, because I was doing to each other so something january. Six takes up a lot, their energy only because that's the time on that stuff came to them. When you're saying little like when you're saying that that type of violence that type of rhetoric type of intimidation has been something that the people have expired in stem felt for much longer than exactly. I see, I see you in twenty twenty four its biden vs versus tromp. Again, how would you vote a country you're just year, you take it often see

I am ready to look into other countries. It is that, just if its bite it, An error is that period because of how you feel that, where the country's guy a period rarely at this point, because They don't even matter goes into the white house going through the system. it's not gonna help us. If not, we will help us at the democrats who win we gonna see I'm all by the promises that not gonna be fulfilled I'm going to get a whole bunch of excuses. Oh the republicans bought this. I couldn't get that republic like they're, going to do the same thing they did last year and the year before, they're going to go back and forth were fighting with each other, while people out here dying they're only going to do because that's all they've been for the past four years. With a fight, people, like all, we got a piper demography, let right now! Well guess what might never pfeiffer, notably.

You know more than any other demographic group. Equally in america, black women are loyally democratic voters and have backed the party through all of those things you are talking about. in terms of need, our promises that may not have been followed through or things like that. The EU arctic violating a different relationship to Democrats than there, but I'm just here is largely there's been a lot more rhetoric about the importance of black women? Coming from Democrats, Resonated with you any good. I mean it's gonna say right away forever, like a black woman I get the blackboard to tap into the black community. Nothing. We did more things done towards then. What we are voting for democracy, we open the Democrats. Do we look in the politicians

it would allow because they went on a war on drugs or crisis or whatever it is. children as been locked up. This was a bit of good night one thing to another: We still await the while black woman out their fight in the politicians we might join. I just because we need to be seen now we're doing that, because we have no choice now. This is one thing. This is a day of emergency because we're going to start going out there and letting the world see that we are here. We start thinking in a way like look at it as a duet, blacks run in the republican party you're probably get one or that may be able to run and that because the ngos that did that they let That herschel walker made a couple of weeks ago, which made me

in and out, we used a lot of black people when he said I'm nothing, but a dumb country, boy, yup, you're, not educated in all this other stuff, that's how they see us and it was bad because that's something that the Jews! That's why people are now that herschel walker, because we like doing Well, you know one adult which we notice are cool and you're really into it. Just to make yourself look like a fool, but then on the senate side, they'll use it and say: well, you know that's the typical black man that's not right, because everything that man is going through in his life that pulls back when the black community that just not on a black person. That's what people understand it doesn't have happen, we were before community because we all the cards related the thing with my my why candidates can be the visuals. Were black candidates are represent added entire community? Yes, exactly you may judge your son as

debating factor for you getting involved in politics. We now have how tell me that story. How did it happen? my muslim was getting old and more more and were probably thought police officers dealing with black men. Snatching about the cart oh he's also says. Not even knowing the law and feeling like they are in charge over pizza and my guy, my step son was murdered

And when he was murdered, we literally went to the police and the way you I'm sorry, but the way the police treated us with soda scotch from newport like a college he's a racist sisters and brothers boy was twenty one year old kid having grey kid and the way they made and destroyed thing. I don't want to get a good guy. Who are you? What does that mean? You don't see it? Will you really don't care about with oil, but who are you representing only

what was going on with black children, black men and black people, how many times did any kind of police officer go to jail, really go to jail, just to throw a probation, and then we look for governments to help us. I will wait, wait a bit. I pray you of this in what they do. Well, we gotta say here: we have to deal with the they won't have to deal with it to rebuild weight, because who are we to talk to we gonna we going to do that. story brings up a lot for me as a black man, Allow me, as a journalist, a lot for me. Someone who has talked to a lot of people who feel like you who feel unseen and politics. How do you like it does filled?

wrong then abandoned. My next question is how you overcome that, because it just feel like it should not be our job, but it does also feel like. It is right like how do you overcome what we both know to be the. Deep discrimination, the deep ignorance that This even among Democrats really have really go now, because this battle is so much bigger than one in ten thousand ten million. We all know we don't know how people will be truly feel they. May I tell you tat, You smiling and be happy. You know you think good

next thing. You know everything gets pulled out from under you. We don't know because it's hard to trust anyone when you clearly can't either and we can yeah document we can see. I I it's written by people like you. How do you think the country looked at five years from now best? If we even got Bobby, I appreciate your time really reach out. I appreciate your honesty. Appreciate doing you think do in better day. The what I hear from a show, and their voters who represent the promise of the obama coalition? Is is that the party is not position for this moment. Doesn't. What it stands for and struggling a fight back against

or unified and radicalized right wing and love. the majority of Democrats will respond to the parties message this year. This is no ordinary year, so ass, you think long and hard. but the moment were in a message Then Biden repeated this week in washington, in our bones We know democracy at risk is at risk. We also know this. Is within our power each and every one of us to preserve our democracy, that the country is not so far apart that problem, as can be made. I know this and that a country united tempered democracy. You have. the power, it church secure decision, afraid of the nation, the vague and solve america. Wiser it always does with the people, your hands in your heart and your balance, my fellow

if our key group of voters the ones who once offered the prospect of a new generation of democratic dominance. It's not resonating knots, long ago they were the ones who believed in the promise of open change. Now they see broken system in cape Oh a producing either So if the system has worked, why protected hmm we, the midterms anglicans indigenous peoples, must be indiscretions for all the work. We are only five percent of the world.

Populations, but we are protecting eighty percent of the world's biodiversity, so we are not only evicting. We are also. The notion that was hindu, merou Ibrahim, a rolex awards, laureate and environmental advocate, who works to raise the voice of indigenous people to help tackle climate change, to discuss Other inspiring leaders, visit n y times dot com, flash, modern dash leaders, the run up is reported by mean instead heard it and pray

despite a lisa Gutierrez caitlin o keefe, its edited by franny car, talk, the risk and their sin and lisa Tobin, but the regional music by dan, pow Marian was honour and the least about eating it was mix by corey shrapnel in fact, checked by caitlin love. Special thanks to polish Schuman, sam donate David. How finger julia Simon murphy, much obliging shannon bustin now globally, Jeffrey miranda, romani masilo and the team at the upshot things what for listening, to hear more episodes other one up search for it were you get your podcasts and thanks.