Today's presenting sponsor is simply save home security tommy? What's your halloween thing, do you save your candy, or did you eat it all at once? I think I kept it in like a stash and I saved it and ate it slowly over the course of let's be honest days, if not yea, I was gonna, say the first few days. I think I probably like five or so pieces of candy at once. If you're looking to save this fall right now, you can get forty percent off any new simplisafe system. It was named the best home security system of twenty twenty three by us news and world report. Don't quite know what the connection with the halloween candy to the to the rest of the simply safe ad. Wasn't this one someone stealing your many are: let's do it that way, don't let anyone still your candy, you simply safe. Like john love, it he set it up himself, he's been using it for years and its protected, and because it's fantastic technologies power by twenty four Evan, professional monitoring for less than a dollar a day, half the cost of traditional homes, security with new twenty four seven

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you're mad cow. Why my eyes it's nice to see you re to see it? Last time I was here, I was on crutches John remember, yeah yeah. That was my last book. Do I did the whole thing on crutches right was october of twenty nineteen. before it everything got interesting. I worry about your butt a bit later. We're also going to talk about president Biden's growing number of political challenges and donald trump's growing number of legal challenges. But first we are now on week, three of house republicans, failure to agree on which of them should be speaker or a clown show that has paralyzed the government just a few weeks before it runs out of money and just a few days after president Biden asked congress to pass one hundred billion dollars in additional funding to defend ukraine against putin, israel against Hamas, taiwan against china and beef up security along our southern border. So since

Jordan, went down in flames. Last week, eight house republicans have declared their candidacy for speaker. Actually, nine did, but we we lost one tonight so lady. What do you mean we'll be like he lost tragically yeah? No, we just when we turned up. We thought I thought he'd been in my pocket, some guy. His name is from, pennsylvania, dam user. There you go tommy user user maser. He went down anyway. None of these people are well known to anyone outside their districts, who isn't a political junkie, including the leading contender majority whip tom emmer of minnesota, whose face I couldn't pick out of a lineup. If my life depended on it, all I know is that there was rumored to be some bad blood between donald trump and Amor after he voted to certify the two thousand and twenty election, though here's what trump said when he was asked about emma on Monday

is my biggest fan lp the fan, so I don't know that I said there's only one person they can do it all the way. No, that is grace gave down said I want a speaker, would do it for you that is Tom Amor tweeted, that clip of trumps Non endorsement of Tom amber and said. Thank you, MR president, Thank you for putting my name in your mouth. Even in that way, in a way that was not to me and so do you think there is any reason to believe that the internal dynamics, but have republicans without a speaker, will change with any of these candidates. And can you name more than tat The candidates up more than two of the end of the aid tom Amor. Thank you. You go go of. Peat sat p,

session relations is actually I recognize you out of your front anymore. He vs areas of republican scandal. It's right, yes, because there is a time to learn that it was a different sessions. I then, Effort at each other regard. Yes, so jeffson, whose you passed you got it yet I did, it was more than it was more than two. It was the one that you and I both half. It was a sense of ancient maize maze or something like that muse. Are you scr? He was a home care magazines, home caring award recipient in two thousand and six I can give you guys one more and that's all I know is byron: Donald's, oh yeah yeah man than that I don't have a hearing on the fox. That's right! That's her! Somebody! anyway, JANET only. She outside my serious question, any reason to believe that these internal dynamics change this week. No, I mean there's nothing in there's nothing. Unless there's some great reveal about an incredible set of leadership.

these among one of these candidates it we can't name who we couldn't pick out of a lineup who we probably couldn't name even if we had their names in front of us like you know what I'm not sure we would get their names pronounced correct. No, I don't think it's a personality or a personnel problem that the republicans have. I think the problem that they have is that there's no good job in government in a party that doesn't want government so there's being like the highest ranking job you can get is still the worst job ever, because anybody with a job in government is obviously suspect, and so, I think, being out anti institutionalist when it comes to the federal government. Just means there's not in they'll have to I guess. They'll, finally have to figure something out about how to get somebody in there, but I also feel, like I dunno how much any of them fear any of the things that we think rationally would put pressure on them. You know the government will shut down. Well, that's the reason they fired. Mccarthy is because he stopped that from happening,

we won't be able to fund our allies that that that's gonna keep them up, and I right, I guess I feel like they ve been hoisted by their own anti majority area. But I heard their rhetoric has its like. Now that a couple people can stop someone from being speaker, then every incentive is for the most extreme members of the caucasus to continue doing that because, as you pointed out, most of them do care about all those things you mentioned, certainly mad gates and the eight people seven or eight people who successfully ousted mccarthy, don't give a shit about any of that. I think I mean for me. I see this as sort of it's the it's the venn diagram of an hilarious and scary, which has been a of our lives politics for these past seven or eight years, but it is funny that they can't just among themselves, come up with somebody to be the next person they fire now, even if it's just for a month. What I like it is it's ridiculous and

same time. I just keep thinking about all of the legislatures around the world. That used to be a real thing that became rubber stamps or that got watered down or became potemkin legislatures when those governments changed from democratic forms of government into strongman forms of government mean one of the things that happens is that every other form of governmental authority has to wither or be refashioned, so that it is in service of the strong man in order for the strongman to lead an authoritarian government, and obviously you know I I I dunno, if you polled republicans in public office as to whether or not the

want that, but by hook or by crook, that's the project, their part of right now and I dont know that they want to fix it yeah. No, it doesn't seem like that, and feeling I can think about. Is the governments can shut down on a couple weeks, and there is at least you know. Twelve members republican us members who were sitting in districts, the Joe Biden one, and if this chaos as paired with the government shut down- and they start here and from people at home- that there's a government shut down, because these clowns can get their act. gather and elect a speaker, and so therefore it's actually hurting people that maybe those republicans in the Biden districts either say we're going to reach out to democrats to try to get something done or they're going to cave and say alright, we'll let one of the crazy right wingers speaker yeah, they seem equally likely and equally unlikely. The Democrats have done a good job and came to has done a good job at making sure that democratic fingerprints are off this mess. The

republicans. I think we're counting on a government shut down and maybe they're counting on this legislative shut down. Now, as some being blamed by the average man on the street on the Democrats, because Joe Biden is president and so therefore any time something goes wrong in government and there is a president of the democratic party. You can blame that president. You can blame his party, even if you yourself caused the problem. In this case, I think it came jeffreys even for people who are paying very attention has created an environment in which it is obvious that this is the republicans on problem and not democrats, so that may be the creates more of a path for them to come up with some power sharing agreement. Tummy Joe Biden hasn't said too much about this mess. Understandably go view of things.

play it do you think it's worth him getting involved in a bigger way if this keeps going or is this area not my circus, not my monkey sort of thing yeah me. I think political polarization is such that anything he does or says will probably have the opposite. Impact within the republican party will not be perceived as helpful or will be twisted to be unhelpful in some way. So I mean trump, jumping in endorsing people that hasn't seen their dear leader and a guy like you, Well, your singer, loser of the viktor Orban, ization of of government re, where you just sort of the state withers around or whether it's the judiciary, attacks on the freedom of the press. Ironically, though, the legislature did this version of it to themselves that gates came forward with a motion to vacate and made it. So any one. Member can down the speaker, and now the entire institution seems to be withering on the vine and unable to fix itself, but I do know Joe Biden getting. It would seem to me. I do know that he's got a lotta swat here that

Worry, though, that it is the mega wing of the republic, I mean as their another wing, it's the mega east. Members of the party who did this to the congress, and that seems a very worrying I mean it was, you know, went when it was the the my withering in Moscow right it was united russia. That was helping that to it's end, and I just think that the the the party that, this is part of a strong man authoritarian, take over project we'll see individual members of that party do themselves out of jobs to serve the larger purpose of installing their later, and so I mean again that's like the doomsday look out but I dont know how this ends, what ya think Biden would help I think by getting involved right now. I do think if we get close, because I also think that for most of the country this is like inside baseball and they don't know. What's going on right now,

muslim hate, washington and they see dysfunction in washington and they don't like it, and I don't really know who to point their finger at right. Unfortunately, so I think, as we head towards a government shutdown, then eh. I think that Biden could go out there and say that just what I was saying earlier, which is like these clowns can't get their act together and because of their own petty grievances, their own ambition. People are going to be put out of work. People aren't going to get government benefits that they are they're going to beach. Women and children who are on food assistance is going to be air, travel delays, because these assholes couldn't figure out how to elect to speak, and I think that's probably useful messages we get towards november. So how I was, how does he make sure that lesson is sort of herds those terms rather than what you're saying tommy in terms of people hate washington, they blame washington. They don t

one differentiate between who it is. I mean I. I was sort of arguing that the Democrats have done a pretty good job, keeping democratic fingerprints off this property, making it a pure republican problem. But it sounds like you think that people are going to blame everybody, if only one side, there's a pew survey that went around recently, which showed that the average voter just hate washington. As the taz know, the approval of the institution of congress has like six per cent. That was really terrible and be a professor. I mean we've seen, we've been through a round of this, and even if poll after poll shows that we've made this argument well and most people don't blame the by dint of most people hold her humble. It still goes on the ledger of america kind of a mass uncertain sour mood that contributes to Joe Biden approval ratings concerns about the economy, a world that is incorrect.

Is that whether or not any in any individual issue, Joe Biden may have support or may have less weakness on the whole people having a sense of the country is moving in a wrong direction becomes blamed for him. I think he could keep democratic hands off the problem. By having Joe Biden go out there and say look. This is a we had a deal. I had a deal with Kevin Mccarthy. A bipartisan spending deal that we both agreed to. We both compromised a little bit. He went back on his word. Then they fired him. Then there was complete chaos. We are very willing to work with republicans on a bipartisan deal on a bipartisan spending deal. I got Mitch Mcconnell over here in the senate. He's willing to do it. Some republican centers to into it, but as this maga extreme wing of the house, can't even agree among themselves on a speaker and everyone's hurting because of it cause the government

the shutdown- and I think that keeps him as the like bipartisan dealmaker, but still lays the blame on republicans and probably he'll get the chance to have a bigger audience for this. As we get closer to the shutdown, I mean there's another venn diagram, which is the venn diagram that republicans have to smash together to get to the two hundred and seventeen votes that they need right. That has to be an overlap of of of the people who want the governor just want this problem off their plate and the people who love this fight and love. This mastery can smash those people together and to get to seventeen. They couldn't do that with Jim Jordan, even under incredible amounts of pressure. There were still you know two dozen roughly people that were ain't, even in the face of all that pressure to say now. I think that that's like a heartening sign, but it is a worry. It is really worrying that yeah, we don't know which way this is going to go, but if you were looking act and, alas, six or seven years and said, hey what you gonna bet

And are going to bet on, squishy republicans are going to be brave, are going to be cowards of being cowards means going along with whoever the last person is in front of their podium before the government closes or does something kind of slightly daring and they decide to go, be legends and and come on. I can figure out some kind of a deal like it's a scary thing to bet on to bet on bravery with these people yeah, and I think I in general, I think in politics trick plays, do not work. anything that know like a discharge petition, never works like the the end. The you know that the restriction and again like, even if you subtract all the violence from that like I know well turned their secret other electors and then vice president pets will be Stockton will know what to do, and then in the letter, then the answer, but like all of these stupid trick, plays that use some buddy in as a one alan law school could invent as a way through the constitute like it. Just never works straight up. Stuff is always the way it ends up

I will it out. Yes, we we didn't want the coin. Someday we were using light. All there are exceptions, are the impeachment there isn't like obamacare, you know, tat kennedy dies, we lose. The soup majority in the senate did come up with a trick play which is like wait. If we pass the house building, those got lots typos, which will be dealing with for a decade. We can do reckoning. Nation. We can find a way through it once in a long while, yes, once in a while, long while what really weird legislation,

it can happen every once in a while, it can happen. Speaking of president Biden, his political challenges keep piling up, his polling isn't great, but even if you don't believe all the polls, he is an incumbent president who's asking an extremely grumpy electorate to stick with him and now his plan to spend another hundred billion dollars supporting foreign wars, one of which is currently dividing the democratic party. The washington post, also reported over the weekend. Biden quote, continues to express frustration in private conversations about the state of his polling in battleground states in a shit and on friday, democratic congressman dean, phillips of minnesota is expected to announce a primary challenge to the president in new Hampshire, a time that dean phillips gave it up. Oh no, it's happening. my god, he apparently other reporting, said it like. He hasn't made the final final decision, but everything's prepared they're going to new Hampshire there's going to be yeah, it's pretty naissance the pregnancy yeah. They don't want to let it leak out in advance because they don't want to take away from the excitement again. Dean phillips, if you

be a picture of tom emmer and dean phillips. I would not be able to tell you who's who but they're both from minnesota and maybe they'll kiss yeah wow. Let's start with our within Israel tommy. There been quite a few stories about urban american and muslim american leaders saying they will not vote for Joe Biden in two thousand twenty four because of his support for Israel. How big of a problem do you think that is for the president? And is there anything he can do to fix it short of calling for a ceasefire or withholding aid to Israel, which he does not seem inclined to do at this point I mean I, I do think, there's some real political risk here. I think that battleground states like michigan and pennsylvania, we won by some thin margins. Michigan was

under fifty thousand votes, but pennsylvania was pretty close. If a bunch of muslims are arab, american voters decide to stay home when in the past cycle they voted overwhelmingly for Joe Biden. I think that could really matter. I also think a lot of people are talking about this like this is the first time that these communities have voiced frustration with Biden, gossip policy. That is not true that protests in twenty twenty one during a previous bombing campaign to gaza- and so I think the first thing Biden should do- is more outreach. Think to some of these communities like he's incredibly empathetic, he did this meeting with the families of victims who are killed, or taken hostage in Israel. Something similar would be good for folks with family in Gaza. I also think there is a real risk of losing young boaters fur along similar lines that people who are just less supportive of the war effort in poles or less support of alarming is real near the supplemental generally like a hundred six billion to foreign countries, is now

it's going to be very popular. I don't think we've all watched the polling on ukraine support ticked down over time, so I think there's a lot of riskier politically from much different angles. Was there any parallel situation like this in the obama administration, in terms of obama, worrying about the same types of support in the same parts of the country? Trying to think I mean there was less you know, maybe in twenty fourteen there was a pretty intense war in Gaza, but I don't remember being having the same political overtones, products was after the reelect, but he added the reelect was all there wasn't a lot I guess there was He was right around the real act, but more italy: it was a campaign waged about the size and role of government and the economy right, and so you didn't have any, except for those crucial last couple months after Benghazi, right before the election, you didn't really have an election that was fought on

foreign policy issues. I was thinking about president obama statement that he put out on Israel in Gaza today and the measured the measure in tone that the length of it, the measured tone, the sequencing of it and everything. Obviously, it all very, very carefully calibrated to convey exactly what he wanted convey- and I was just wondering if that, if there was anything to he'd there. That is either an attempt to nudge president Biden, wonder chicken or the other, or even just to nudge, his messaging in this issue, in a way that is more seen as more responsive to more communities- I mean I you know I think, wanting to way- and I think he wrote this himself- everything we understand- I think he like cares deeply about this sort of wants to guide the conversation a little bit. He probably watches the discourse online being particularly toxic in it

There's a man he's trying to bring people together. I would imagine, if anything you trying to not piss off or nudge Biden publicly with this messaging anything like that, he would do privately. I think they private ran it by the white us first before putting it out. My guess, you haven't, I I I took it, I I read it and I thought it was very thoughtful and what I took it to be was someone who views himself as a like a person who understands how to to narrate some of the most difficult issues that we face as a country and trying to just lay out an articulation of what a and a democratic position that is both supportive of israel and concerned about the humanitarian crisis in Gaza. Would I would like, as a reflection of what the Biden administration policy is, is might like. I've been articulation of what a democratic vision for a pro israel, but humanitarian american foreign policy would look like yeah zones or to strains of his thinking that I noticed in that statement. One which is like has never been a big fan of baby

and been yeah or his policies rage and also there was shades of his two thousand and two speech against europe. War and saying you know, obviously, but in that speech he talked about going after terrorists and going after Al Qaeda, but and he's not opposed to all wars, but is opposed to dumb wars, and you really gotta to think about before you go and you send troops into battle and the consequences, and so it's about a little bit in that and that statement as well. The thing that I was just thinking reading that today is I'm going back to the decision making in the obama administration about syria, and that was one of these things where I just felt like that. under a tree in the moment, was so wrong. Like the year of plunder tree, we had her and decision making on. Syria was just an aim, which is bad. Bad takes left right and centre, and I felt like he was actually did in in some important ways trying to do a very principle.

Very non partisan, very thirty thousand feet thing, which was congress should be involved in decisions about the? U s: military use of force, and everybody likes to throw proverbial bombs around here, but if we're going to throw real bombs, we should commit ourselves as a country to what we are going to do here and congress needs to be involved. This is not something that president should be doing on his own, and everybody attacked him for all syria decisions, but just felt like there was this moment where he was trying to say, there's a way to deal with this structurally and a principled terms that ought to guide us both for this conflict and in the long run, and he didn't go back to that. I

but I feel, like that's the kind of knowledge that he can give which is look at it. Look at it from let's not just about being really good about talking about people and talking about human suffering, which he is very good at talking about that and talking about recognising peoples for humanity. It's also, I feel like he has the capability and I feel like ass president. He had the capability to say there is a bigger responsibility that we have here, which is too, who we are as a country and how our system of government works and how we being on issues like this. Some still sort of waiting for some breakthrough, like that on Israel on Gaza. That makes people feel like we can have a substantive fight, that's about who we are that and how that can be reflected in our national response, and I think you know inch singly, while theirs, when you look at afghanistan and iraq wars. Obviously, the original sin of the iraq war was invading in the first place. I never should have happened, but in terms of how both ended both were

I heard some sort of political resolution to end them correctly or we have I now. If I can't stand. Obviously that didn't work out similar challenges in iraq led to an unstable government and security situation that quickly deteriorated. When are you s? Troops left, I think, that's part of what he thinks: it's a: u can roll troops into Gaza, but unless there's a two state solution, or at least some sort of viable path to one we're not gonna get to a peaceful, estate for anybody. Yeah wars are easy to start and hard to end, and usually they don't end with military might alone so and the for the? U s to have generals. You know and prepare today's news advising the I d f and on what not to do and how not to do it right now and it's just it's a really. It's a really precarious time.

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Well. Today I dunno dot com, slash psh, twenty five. What did you guys think of the post story, which was mainly about the Biden campaign? Potentially expanding it's twenty five million dollar advertising campaign. You have any thoughts on So I can argue it both ways. Anyone want to pick aside idea that idea. What's the bad idea argument, An idea would be like spending twenty five million dollars a year before anyone votes is burning cash, no one's paying attention, similar efforts that were run by this super pac in the story, future forward haven't paid any dividends. Ultimately, the the winning message is probably going to be some sort of contrast with trump. So don't spend your hard dollars you're. You know you're the the most challenging to raise money. That gets you the best rates on advertisements down the stretch to day now. I don't necessarily believe that, but like that, would be the argument against

Yeah, don't I guess you know they ve started running that sort of economics out and we talked about the time wondering. So. What is the value of doing that right? Now? That's not the kind of thing is there some at their seeing and focus groups are in pulling it basically says long before we get to the to the kind of to the following. a real contrast. There's a lot of work. We have to do to strengthen the general sense of what Joe Biden has done. Any account. And I just I don't know any more with the value. I just. I truly don't understand how to think about the value of television advertising now, when, when media is so fractured, when a lot of the people that are most important to reach, like young people aren't necessarily going to see them like. How do we think about that? And I I just think it's a campaign. Sing not just a political problem. A cultural problem of we really dont know how to reach people who don't pay attention to the news we now How to talk about the news in this sort of noisy maelstrom.

conversation and we know how to reach those people and engage those people. We not a gauge the people listening to get them to go, knock on doors. Anything that's really important, but there, millions and millions of people who are not paying attention at all or who get the news in a really and attenuated way and reaching those people changing their minds is getting harder and harder. I think they're part of what they're doing is testing not just different ads and different messages, but different ways of breaking through to precisely the people that you're talking about. and ass. I think the benefit to the other side. With a will. I guess you you had the benefits, are you? Are you all right was about eight about you, but I don't really believe that, and I think that it sounds like they're. Just did this relatively

by early on to sharpen your message for your much bigger ad, buy down the road, yeah and they're collecting all kinds of data that I don't think was even available to us in in two thousand and twelve or even in twenty. Sixteen to the Clinton campaign about like exactly how different demographic groups different audiences are responding to different kinds of ads, so that I think it's like more of a testing phase. I think the bigger debate here that you see in that story is how do you convince people or should the purpose the ads be to convince people that actually Joe Biden has. You know, accomplished a lot that the economies better than they think or is that just telling people what they don't actually feel? And on that note, I still think that it is really hard to convince people

if they are grumpy about the economy, that actually the statistics say differently and we're doing great and if I just repeated enough and you'll believe it, and I think you ve got a set up. The contrast I think more effective way to do. It is, and I'd be interested in seeing have their audiences react to this, but setting up a contrast with trumpery using our. If, if you will, let me again, here's what I will do to help people who are struggling with costs and here's how I'll do it and by the way, here's what trumps said he'll do if he gets elected and not just on the economy, but on every other issues I mean if sort feels like the answer is yes like they need to deal with sharpening their message. It is going to come down to contrast with republican nominee and they need to change They prevailing perception of Joe Biden, and I dont think that the prevailing perception of Joe Biden is impenetrable by advertising. Just because I mean what spaces are people going to to get their information now, it's very fractured

tv is one of those spaces. Social media is itself actively fracturing as we speak, the other forms of information that people get our of evolving constantly it like. I don't know that in environment, that doesn't need better choice than advertising they asked that emerges in its place and you can't created different news environment but because the news environment on the right has been so negative on the economy, particularly, you do need positive messaging about being constructive on the economy. Just to stand up against that. Why not do it through ads yeah, I feel a guy. I believe two opposite things. One is that the sign of intelligent, yet a fisher Thank you for saying that, but I It is always a mistake if you're trying to convince people that their lived experiences some way wrong, and we should just take at face value all of this polling that says people believe in the economy. Right now they have a lot of frustrations. There very worried that very anxious and that if what you're try,

do is tell them they're wrong, you're, making a big mistake, and then I also think. On the other hand, we also see that yes, there, there is a kind of is partisan bias in pulling on the economy when, when trump is, president republicans think it's doing better when a Democrat is bright, president democrats think it's doing better. That polarization is not equal. Ah republicans are better team players when they're answering questions about the polling- and I do think there is you know we talked about- we talk- was all the kind of hand, wringing and self regulation we did a speechwriters during the obama years to always make sure we said things are getting better but they're not good enough. You always had to do the first part to make sure you weren't getting ahead of where people were on the economy. But if you do that for long enough, you don't get to the part will help people way, they believe that things are actually getting better and you see some unlike trump when he is in charge. Things are fucking gangbusters when things are not there in the toilets

simple, and I don't know I don't. I don't know how to put those two things together, because there's a part of me that thinks well, you know if pete, if we don't think we're winning people watching I think we're winning either, and you know we have to be our own boost sometimes I just don't know how you square the circle. I think that in impart talking about jobs just making like what people mean when they mean the economy, they mean lots of different things and you can personalize it or you can thinkin. You sort of fake ro terms. You can talk about it in terms of what your cousins, personal sort hence are whatever but being able to talk about. The one metric of jobs seems to me to be something where they can create. They can create narrative that autistic, because it so overwhelming in terms of the jobs numbers and the contrast is there and the raw value absolute numbers or their yeah. I think you ve gotta, show that you are fighting to improve people's lives and that you have a plan to do that.

We did that in twenty Levin obama give that job speech before congress, and obviously unemployment was the big problem there. Now its inflation employments on an issue, and he had this refrain, which was like here's my jobs bill, but republicans you ve been

It's policy democrats for this policy send this to my desk I'll sign it right away, and it was like a lot of we intentionally made it a lot of action and then he could take that out on the road and then say that these republicans are are blocking progress, that they won't have a vote on these bills that are very popular in Bi partisan. These are the kind of things that will create jobs. We've created, so many so far were climbing back from the recession. But this is what we need to do, and this is why you need to send me back to the white house, and I do think that I'm sure he'll probably do that in the state of the union. I would imagine, and then have the state of the union be sort of a blueprint for the campaign this year, but I think that's the piece, that's missing in the message right now what you are describing about him saying- and you know it's it's it's not that, and we can't get things done. I look at all these bipartisan things. I've gotten done it's just this maga wing

the republican party that they're the ones who have now shut down the legislature and and all the sudden. I just feel like that's, it is it. I just feel like it's almost inarguably the correct message and it is inarguably his constant message. I could really is all he does and he gets no credit for it at all, and I think the prescription is just to keep doing it yeah. I don't think it works on people who are discussing politics, but I do think it works on

well, who don't? Listen very often, and every once in a while they're going to hear some line from some speech and if that's it, it's the best possible thing am to hear, and it's just hard because the more he has like all of these challenges that he has an expat and expected like all these foreign policy challenges and everything else. He doesn't get to do that message or deliver that message as much like when you have to be president and you have to go out to the to the podium into the rose garden and talk like you can't be as political as I think some of this is Joe Biden, gets back on the campaign trail. The ad campaign cranks up more people are paying attention to Biden vs trump than he has the opportunity to deliver. That message like he has been for the last four years yeah. But right now I think not enough people are hearing it and he doesn't get to say it as often I'm wondering also- and this is petty- so you will forgive me in advance, but I have always felt like there is a little bit of up

I, like boy version of a beauty contest that happens in presidential general elections, which is the person who seems physically stronger, tends to win and gross. But it's often the case, and so I I felt like that's why that you know define and as old and doddering, and all these things has been such a focus on rights that they know like with lizard brain that that's really the most important thing they can do, but we have been in this circumstance for the last I mean you could say for the last eight years, but are the last seven years, but really for the last few months in which trump physically seems like he's falling apart and in which he makes a lot of false day. not just false statements but like he gets things wrong and he slurs his words and he doesn't seem well any seems unhealthy in europe on the little resident three times last week. I think intends end A bush was president and victor Orban is the head of turkey, and I mean an on the spot and just not being able to pronounce things that really. None of that is is variant.

wharton unless we're going to define the contest between Two men as an arm wrestling contest as some sort of in our test of stamina, physical strength, which I feel like the right has really been staking out as their preferred ground. It's I don't know what happens there with both the with trump himself, starting to feel that The left do a good job clipping those and sharing them by starting better than used to yeah and if, but I think, the message behind when we share those has to be. This is if it's. This is a clown and on serious person versus Joe Biden, who is a serious person who's trying very hard. I think we win that fight if it you say Joe Biden's all but donald trump's, also old, who are you say Joe Biden's flub in words, but donald trump's, also flubbing words, because then it is that contests of like who can seem less old. Yes, anyway, let's talk about donald trump and he's not exactly in the best political position. Either he's dominating the republican primary, but the rest of his polling is quite bad,

had he keeps getting bad legal news about the ninety one criminal charges he's facing last week, two of his former lawyers and co defendants, sidney powell and kenneth cheese. Bro great name decided to plead guilty as part of the corrupt scheme to overturn the election in georgia. How plead guilty to six misdemeanor counts cheese, bro to a felony count of conspiracy to commit filing false documents. I e the fake electors both have agreed to testify in their co, defended trials, including trump, who was asked about all of this on monday, no not at all. We did nothing wrong. This is all by yourself. All of these indictments are you see I was ever indicted practically never heard. The word wasn't aware that register if there is no such thing as indictments before this, and

either way I wasn't indicted, prove I was fake news, hoxie hoxie, liberal Biden. Wasn't I I'm not indicted? He was indicted, no puppet! No puppet yeah, that's where that's, where we're at right now, alright, so I've seen some people say that powell and cheese bros pleas are very bad for trump, I've heard others say we don't yet of their testimony will be all that damning. What do you think rachel? What our involvement in like could what they know be potentially damning for trump. You know it remains to be seen in terms of what kind of witnesses they're going to be, because it's not only what you know and what prosecutes, no, you know, and they can compel you to testify to, because you have done it. You ve agreed to testify in exchange for lenient. For yourself, it's not just that It's also kind of how the trial is going in terms of how a witness lands. I actually think that the most important thing about powell and she's borough pleading is that it means there's not going to be a trial

in full county in october, and the reason that's important is because funny willis kept saying I want to put em all in the same court room all at once it to sit. It's it's a conspiracy. It's a rico conspiracy, I'm happy to try them all at once. Now I just wrote a book about the nineteen forty four great sedition trial, where they put twenty nine defendants in the same court room and it was simple. Small. Not only did it end in a mistrial ended in a mistrial, as the judge died, it was amazing little. I dont want note independence in the same room, but the fact that funny willis wanted it and has argued for it tells you something about her case and she did not want she's burrow in political first, because that would mean pre viewing her case for the rest of the defendants and them both pleading out.

ins that there's not going to be some dry run, where of the defense counsel's for all these defendants get to see what it is. She's got and that's better for her prosecution for her prosecution strategy. I think that there's that there isn't a preliminary case. I also think that I saw someone to for her to offer a deal to both of them that doesn't involve any jail time. You would think that they have some kind of valuable testimony, maybe not about trump, but at least about and she's cheeseburger was dealing not directly with trumpet with rudy and couple others, so it seems that they must have something valuable, a shooting them any better. How does the? What is the jury? Think of them as witnesses? Yet I want is the jury. Think of that that part of the seriousness of that part of the allegation I just feel like it. It just think, there's anything that we can say

I don't think there's any witness in any of these cases where we can say, oh, that person's going to testify. That means axe is going to happen. In the case I just don't. I just I just feel like when I've looked at big landmark cases of different kinds. It's never it's! Never! That simple! Surely having your co defendants plead guilty. In exchange for a promise to testify against. You is not good news. I don't know how to get it out. We may either batter neutral, but there is also a new time story. Andy sixty minutes, australia, peace, about the australian billionaire morocco, member who trump allegedly spilled secrets to about america's nuclear submarines. Apparently they their hands on some new recordings of anthony pratt. Talking about his conversations with trump liberalism. Listen to there was nothing compared to what are usually he knows exactly what to say. I was about to say so your voice jail but close to it

most of was all These guys want the mafia, trout, river rudy. You already accustomed. Another compare, rudy on that. I hope will be useful wonder whether this is cool. Floral, just sort of like see the passion The human rudy. I like that we're! Always there millennia dinner, you see. I asked the london It'll pull into the case, all the other guys get a look at what they were missing. well and you sit back to him. do that when you walk around with me: ok, let them like the music there, either I thought that offered rudy giuliani a million dollars to come to his birthday party. Why does he think religion any school? That was the climate goals that was troubling?

that guy has a right to know the ever more logical or hinders a member, as I get the best judge of a class taste, the character, There are people that eggs and make a billion. Now, let's go said the mafia thing that he said these says the thing they're like mafia, you wanna be a customer or not. Competitor. Is that, like a mob movie thing that I don't know, I've never heard that love it? I thought that was a great line right there, but I was like maybe I dunno. Maybe that is a mantra that people who are operating adjacent to the mafia tell themselves every morning, customer and competitor, customer than competitive I've never heard of tax. It they'll kill you, I guess kangaroo, be a kangaroo, be ashamed, something we have to stress that the headline news out of this report was the trump gave this guy accidentally or wittingly. I guess a a nuclear sub secrets with a number of warheads, etc. It is interesting, though, that this comes. In the middle of this ongoing impeachment effort, that's trying to like tell a story about the Biden. Crime, family,

You have this. Australian billions are being like tat. I bought it tomorrow, logo I paid rudy millionaires come my birthday party. I like drifted now these and all the rooms for election they re like this is a pay to play scheme. That was this entire trump administration all laid out in this young lax and woody. For it was my, let me tell you about how many nuclear submarines we have and let me tell you about that. Ukraine call come on. I did worse than that and it's not even like it's an gets gets in exchange for, like you, you pay this money I'll give you these secrets. It's more like you pay the money now brag too. You know about how great it is to be present at what trump. Also like an did. Events with hand toward his factory would likes praise him at events. If so, just like a back padding competition yeah, it's really small. Let us make sure that we are seeing this guy has like tens of billions of dollars. Very, very wealthy, and you just think like. Ok, if I ever became a person who had thirty four

twenty four billion dollars at every. How would I be like, if I could marilla go on that day You gonna be there that they incur here to swim soothing. Can I want you to say that there is nothing in front of me and then I want to tell my friends. I mean it's just like bordering resolved before that Rich then one of them was president with access to the new equipment. It's also it's! It's also. How small trumpets I mean laugh, rang, oxenham hd treats being the president that you want to silver at night. When he and he walks into the body, goes this oh this holding it was, cold and windy. I'll tell you the story here I got up. He wants you just a desperately wanders run. These weddings just wants to talk to people the sum in thing, which I didn't totally crock at first, so that this? Obviously we don't talk about submarines rain, so their nuclear powered nuclear armed submarines talking about their stock capabilities talking about their weapons, but then, once he told the cardboard magnates billionaire guy

that guy told forty five other people, including journalists, including a half dozen journalists and multiple former heads of state and other foreign government officials. So why I mean so what happens to the classified documents case mean this thus stuff isn't implicated directly in the driver documents case he is listed as a potential. Witness in that case, but the the promulgation of that kind of information to all those people like wow, what do we do about that? Doesn't it makes you think that the evidence in the case is that has gotta be really strong if this stuff wasn't implicated well and also- and also just that, hey no matter what we confiscate, no matter, what we do, the information inside of Donald trump's head, which he is not protecting, is a is at risk of being released. If we don't do something to punish him, that, like it's all for sale and the only way to actually make sure that he hasn't shared, this information is by sending him to jail right.

way to stone the way to the only way up or just if you are sure he doesn't get to be president again. Well that that's sure for sure but then as I do, that in the courtroom, because if we don't stop that motel men in black, I'm one of those yeah, no he'll, have all the secrets or we'll do whatever he wants- has got nothing to lose nothing to lose in the second turn I don't know I mean I don't think there is a solution to it. Right I mean if you go to jail, he's not gonna go to jail for ever held then get out. Also he can make phone calls from jail like there's, there's no, the own. The problem that we are in right now is a country is that the only solution to our problems is to go back in time and not put some These that criminal, in that big, a job and unless you can unknown that I mean you have done that once you ve done. Somebody who is implicated in this much alleged criminal behaviour and they have that kind of a job- there's isn't an easy way out that doesn't hurt the country. What, if someone did that fucked up action? You have go are in bobbin and his car good points. We saw that we saw your segment on an on Menendez

how did you and we were all young to be really yeah? What's wrong with you, democrats we will raise like women. I dont know we're like Joe. Unless introduction we're gonna want the committee, they took him when you took him out of the chairmanship of the Senate foreign relations committee. Why do that cause of his federal felony indictments day, and so then, when superseding indictment came out and it turned out he what he was accused of by the us justice department is being a foreign agent. Did it occur to you at that point that maybe it was time for another step? How is it that he is still the committee? I think it's wild and it was just like a an arrangement of convenience that he didn't receive the last classified briefing

what's going on with the war, it wasn't some sort of formal thing where they were like. No bob menendez, no more classified briefings to you. It was just like: oh he didn't yeah. He didn't do that one. They just sidestepped that as an issue where the the country that was paying him off and as far as I can tell running him as a spy, is directly implicated in what's happening. Currently, the egyptians are one of the other borders of gaza and think I'll skip this prevent this. This is a problem. A lot of problems are hard right. What do you do with the classified information and donald trump's head like I? I really don't. I don't know that there is an answer to that. This is not a hard one. If the Republicans

I want to take bob menendez of the Senate foreign relations committee. Here's what they do, Bob you're no longer on the foreign relations committee. Instead, this other person is yeah and that's it that's all they have to do it's completely within their power. Yes, the republicans could like rise up and try to stop them from installing somebody new but they're not going to because they don't want to fight over bob menendez, because they're not willing to say that menendez should resign right. That's why I don't understand. I don't quite understand we were talking about why the Democrats wouldn't do it and I'm like. Are they worried that permanent is will like change? parties are causing with the Republicans, and I don't know I've even that we are in the majority. I guess it would shave download more, but it still awake, but if the, if he's holding national security hostage for that kind of, threat, we ought to know about that. They should make interesting handle that by like bag, but it, but that's the fuckin move. You go full tramp tramp, pardons you, you go full. Does it? Do you go full fuckin trump, you go first,

the boy. Virtually delay that you were right about enlightened regulators are pretty smart. When you walk out of that jail, never generally seem. Our aim is not only those that day that day is a smart guy. Doesn't nobody bob chill out? You could use a listener, but also democrats in the Senate league, to us. Like did. I ever tell what I explained yourselves literature leaked to me. Call me I, as fellow members when, because he's been really forward. Looking and Ames yeah, and it's like. What's with all your colleagues like, I don't speak for the, I can't speak for them, but who, Let me say that I am so like this is just unconscionable like it's one. Yes, you can talk about the republicans and everything's wrong with them. That's fine, but at the end of the day, the the thing you have to answer to to whom ever you answer is for your own act. And in this case the action of leaving him on the foreign relations committee. When you have the power to remove, him is its

it won't be on the notes. Beyond okay, before we get to break just two quick housekeeping notes, pod save america will be live in Louisville Kentucky in cleveland ohio on october, twenty eighth and twenty ninth we will be joined a journalist, perry, bacon, kentucky congressmen, morgan margarethe, co, host master monaco abortions. Rights advocate kelly, cope. And congresswoman emilia sykes and more a head to cricket dot com, slash events to get your tickets now and see where else we're headed this year, also quick shout out to our friends of the pod subscription community, who are probably listening right now on our ad free feed, wanted to. Let you guys know that I'm stopping by the friends of the pod discord on thursday october twenty sixth for a round of ask me almost anything where I'll be chatting with subscribers and answering your burning questions. If you haven't subscribed to friends of the pod, yet now's the time had to cricket dot com, slash friends to sign up when we come back,

we'll talk to Rachael more about her new book prequel, an american fight against fascism. The parts of america is brought to you by Tommy John. There are exactly two kinds of gifts in the world: woos and o's. Oh I get it want guaranteed whose be bold and give the gift of tommy john underwear, when you give tommy and your loved ones. Are that much more comfortable, so they can do everything better. This softness seas and why not give the gift of comfort to everyone on your list, including yourself, new tommy, john underwear lounge, where an pajamas with over twenty million pair sold and thousands of five star reviews given time John, is a holiday tradition. Ninety seven percent of women and men love getting the gift, tommy John. That's why Tom agendas and have customers they get fanatics. One fanatic, raves, fantastic christmas gift that went so right. She loves the pajamas. I swear

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flash psh. I don't want to talk about your new book called prequel, which is based off your fantastic award. Winning podcast ultra both tell the story of a homegrown fascists plot to overthrow american democracy. Just before we entered world war, two, a conspiracy that reached the highest levels of the us government for people who haven't listened to the podcast or read the book. Could you talk about how serious the threat was? Yes, thank you, and first of all, thanks for asked me about it, and so we had. At the same time that germany went to hitler and ITALY went to miscellaneous, spain went to franco and the french fascists. overran parliament in nineteen, thirty, four and ousted the democratically elected government and the british had the british union effect,

when this was rising everywhere in the world, we had our own problem and we think of americans can confrontation with the nazis as having been the military confrontation when we were good guys and they were bad guys and we went over there and beat them. But here in the united states the it wasn't just that people didn't want to go fight world war, two by very large numbers. Nineteen forty was eighty three percent of the public didn't want us to fight, and it was that there was a big fascist movement here and violently anti semitic associated with right wing, paramilitary groups and associated with the nazi government in berlin to the point where there was a nazi. agent. He was the senior nazi propaganda agent in the united states and he was running a huge multi million dollar propaganda campaign in the united states, like at the behest of the german foreign office, and he had two dozen senators and members of congo.

working for him running all this male out of their offices, so that the postage would be paid by the american taxpayer. Franking privilege, the thanking privilege, I'm trying to make the franking privilege high yeah, so it was I I I it's been it's I it's always been seen as a kind of obscure chapter in american history. I think for obvious reasons, because we had world war two and we won, and with that was that's a very comfortable. That's a very comfortable tale to tell it's more uncomfortable to think about us americans having been on side, but it was more well connected and more radical and more success

well, then I think previously understood and that's what I'm trying to just help us learn that not because it's a the, I don't think, there's any analogy between nazi ism then and in our ultra right today. Obviously only nazis are nazis, only hitler is hitler, but there is an analogy. I think that we can learn from in terms of americans who fought that surprisingly effective surprisingly well connected movement and beat them and shut it down. You draw a lot of parallels, obviously in the book the tour unsaid parallels between then and now. I wonder like what is different about the threat that we face today. What feels different, not just in like the non actual nazis, but just in the in the general sort of larger context, political, social context. I think there's basically like four things that you look for for a democracy, that's at risk of becoming an authoritarian state and lots of experts smarter than me have different lists. For me, it's for one is that you cease not just

targeting of minorities but scapegoating of minority see you get baroque evil conspiracy theories about how they are secretly to blame for all of our problems. Because then you ve got a common enemy that you need a strong man to unite the country against. Then you ve got a. We can have democracy, because those evil people would participate in a democracy is weak and makes us pray that these bad people she got that you ve got dont trust information, dont trust, journalist, science experts only believe the dear leader go here. You trust your prejudices and we ve got the the intrusion of violence and the political space so that the political space becomes a place that normal people can. I can't play if you wanna be a pole worker, but it me If you're, going to end up having death threats and people storming your house, then normal people are going to be poll. Workers see watch for that, but the the last thing is is actually the the most boring and most important, which is technically. Is your democracy, functioning in order to hold on dear democracy. You not only

to defend it, but you need to believe in it and you need to use it to solve the problem of rising authoritarianism, and so people need to believe that the election process and that the democratic process writ large is what we used to solve our problems and the good news in this book and in principle, is that all these members of congress who are all hooked up with this nazi agent to a one. They all got voted out when the american public, through good journalism and good activism and the justice department, exposing them told the american people. What was going on. Even people who are household names have been in congress for twenty five years, who are seen as presidential timber, the president's best friend, all the stuff, all voted out, because the american people did not like that idea. The thing that's different now that worries me is that election denial, ism and don't believe in elections Your vote doesn't matter now mean trump saying today, don't worry about it out and we ve got all the votes. We need just monitor, vote, just

monitor, voting, monitor the vote, count and monitor voting. That stuff is like they just they didn't get far enough with it in the thirties and fortys they were trying to. They didn't get that in their much further along with that messaging, and that's not just bad for people who believe it on its face because they like that site of politics, it's bad for americans who might try to fix this, because all of us need to believe that voting out. People who are close to these sorts of plots and movements is the solution to these plots and movements. When you think about that scenario how played out in the past- and you think about today with you now you on musk, saying: don't listen to these line. Journalists, listen to these blue checks. That gave me money you think about the withering of local news. gerrymandering of districts and would make it incredibly hard, devote shouts and the individuals you're talking about

do you worry more that you know repeating that kind of? Ah you know systems and good guys and women winning wouldn't even happen. Well, yeah yeah! That's what that's the part of it that I'm so worried about. I mean to the extent that you've got people who have and are part of an anti democratic project who are telling you don't believe election results. Don't think that the vote is the way we're going to fix these problems. Don't think that democracy is Countries should run that's bad, but it's really bad. If it's true, it's really bad. If your vote doesn't actually count because either actions, are being stolen somewhere or because jeer, jerry,

standard out of essentially ever being able to have a legitimate saying in in what governance is that applies to you, and so the weakening of that just the technical aspects of democracy takes away the best weapon that we have to to fix this problem, and so it's just it's. It's not abstract. Its urgent are their strengths, that we have or lessons for having gone through this in the thirties that we now drawn that put us at an advantage. As my suit me, will you just described as it was that if history now, Nineteen thirty's, oh here for ways in which things are a little bit worse, what are the ways in which? Right now you look at the way americans are responding or the way our country is reacting to a far right threat that you say speaks to having learned from this very good question, and nobody asks me that question in that way. I'm talking about this, I'm really thought on it. You've still got a yes.

yeah go on, we didn't go for convert yeah, so hot in the studio think, let alone the formula. I'm sorry there was a good question. Those sorry so many of us I think I would say two things: one is the justice depart. Knows not to put twenty nine people on trial in the same court room like that's good, that there's too, big sedition trials that I read about in the book, one in nineteen forty and in that inaction the f b. I really thought this christian front. Show was seven days away from a plot that was supposed to start with the murder of twelve congressmen and they had lots of national guardsmen and, and why pity and lots of bombs? And u s military machine guns, and it was a serious thing, and when those guys were put on trial. The trial did not succeed in convicting any of them and they were all echo and then in eighteen, forty four, we ve got

the even bigger sedition trousers, twenty nine of them. It was seventeen defend its nineteen, forty, its twenty nine nineteen. Forty four that trial also knows successful actions and those guys melted into the boss, which is a very dangerous and bad thing, and I feel, like the justice department has learned from some of those things, the the other fats but I dont know whether or not they ve learned, but I really hope they have. Is that part? what went wrong with the effort to deal with this to the criminal justice system in the thirties and fortys? Is that implies? senators like Burton wheeler dumber from Montana pressured the attorney general to fire, the prosecutor, who was leading the investigation and leading the prosecution and the attorney general caved and did so, and that's really bad president truman, then, in nineteen forty six caved and fired another justice department official who was trying to expose this because among the people who are going to get exposed were his best friends from the senate.

So that the political pressure on the justice department, I hope, is something that has a red flag on it. I think people like Jeff Berman from the justice department, air from the trump era, justice department, raising red flag about those things and having gone through that is is, is it is a little bit of hope there, but that's it. That's that's one example of something that I think we're doing better. Do you think that the pro democracy forces in this country are doing a good enough job, making the case about why democracy is a better system for most people in this country? Like people, our audience, your audience, people who pay close attention to politics like we get all the hour

it's about democracy, where passionate about it. For most people in the country, you don't pay close attention to politics who barely consume the news, who are worried about more things close to home. I wonder if, like we're, making good enough argument, it's hard because you I don't want to scare monger. You know I mean want to, and I I mean the the thing that I try to convey is like will really miss.

When it's gone, yeah, that's a new seventy get dumped yeah, I mean most democracies, don't last, and most countries that have lost democracy, never get it back, and we are a stand out. Example of a country that has held onto a robust democracy for a long time, but there's no reason to think that it is inevitable that we will and to create that sense of, I think, honest precarity around us being a democratic system, just listen to what trump says about voting. Listen to what It says about elections? Why is he describing the election that he won in two thousand and sixteen as stolen? Why is he describing the next election in which is not yet a competitor, as already stolen he's doing this, because he wants people to believe that elections are fake, and so therefore we shouldn't bother having them it's a a challenge of imagination. Can you imagine what a country is like that looks like this, except has a president who never leaves

Right me last week, while president Biden was travelling to Israel and lowering prescription drug prices and putting the brakes on people having to stay paper. Their student loans. Vladimir Putin, in his twenty fourth year of office, went to china to go to a summit hosted by president Shea, whose president for life, so he could meet with victor Orban, whose in his fourteenth an office, so they could talk about how they want a new multi polar world where the united states doesn't led the way anymore right. That's that's the other way that this goes, and I think that we

after. The next step is to draw a line from that sort of system of government to the consequences it has for people in those countries, and other countries is also like. Look at Vladimir Putin's doing with his country right now the applicant, how many people he sending to their debts and how many people he's responsible for slaughter, because that's life in an authoritarian government and by the way life in a democracy can be wonderful, and you know, and also it frustrating and thin, and people can struggle in its infuriating at times, but it's also you know it's I mean, but what does it mean to be in political opposition in the united states, frustration and agonized podcast conversation and occasionally having been a bad things happen in the legislature in which you are torn between mother

make fine or be seriously concerned about the other people who can get it together. Man, that's what political opposition means in this country, but if you are elected volney in russia, your lawyers just got arrested, you're in a penal colony, and your lawyers just got arrested for the crime of representing you. While you are trying to be an option in politician, I just feel like the them, the more we learn about what else our situation could be and what one side of our politics is driving us toward, and I think I think the argument makes itself, but your mileage may vary more original formula. Go of my lanta ooh, that's a norwegian, serious beside I'm getting fire rachel in your new book prequel

there, you go well. Thank you very much. You track. You track the fight. I didn't doubt that audio medium or a you track the fight of those inside and outside the government to repel a takeover by rightwing extremists who are enamored of fascism, anti semitic, conspiracy theories in an all out assault on the left. I don't think would have come as surprised you that there are parallels what we see playing on the far right today, not that you draw an equivalence, but nevertheless, so we're going to read an actual quote, and the question is: is this a quote recounted book or is it from the unwritten book called our present? Is this fascism original formula or is this fascism, the new batch, which is a reference to a film called gremlins? Two that you have not seen yeah? I bet I bet you are correct question one: here's the quote: we all know for whom we are voting. If we vote for blank for the communist, the socialists for the mexican lovers with is about president franklin, delano, roosevelt or president Joseph robin it, but.

I know that it was about roosevelt. Was it also set about button it has been, but this was about roosevelt, that correct behind gave where the whom does was father charles coglan and I noted. included russian numbers in his list which had given it away because today the right when speak the same way about russia? Next question, as as a far right figure warned that a certain group wanted to corrupt you through subversive teaching, destroy family life, dominate people through their vices and undermine the respect for religion. This is about gazing days and the twenty twice or jews and Jews in nineteen. Thirty that changes in the nineties, cities and do no was remember it was it pelee. This was pelee who started a right wing anti semitic. Paramilitary group question. Three I came up originally was, god help me. You know in Australia the sixty minutes cargoes the other way

yeah Kennedy warned that the sitting president had joined with quote a band of his closest thugs, misfits and marxists to destroy american democracy, and we must keep foreign christian, hating communist, marxist and socialist out of america was that a candidate in the thirties or candidate in the unfolding present? Yes, yes, it was- was trump in june of this year, is going to sound like a trump quote. Next quote, I have an idea. This is still a christian country, but there is an objection to use the word christian. They want to take out a take it out of my mouth, the word christ in christian, and they can't do it

What about a manufactured war on christians or a manufactured war on christmas? And the yes answer is yes, but is that is that smith, or is that is mostly? Oh, that's, gen. George Van horn, mostly he's one of my favorite bad guys in the book. Why? Because so he wanted a lot of the different fascist groups and wanted george van horn, mostly to be that furor he'd been deputy chief of staff of the us army. He thought that and campaigned on the idea that all jews in america should be forcibly sterilized like he was really. He was that guy and the army came to him after justified in congress in nineteen thirty eight? I think it was and they said general mostly, we understand you're auditioning for role of american furore for

once you and your friends overthrow democracy and install the type of hitler right government that you're looking for here? You have rights as an american to advocate anything you want. You have put the free speech, however, we are the? U s army, and this is awkward for us, and so, if you want to keep doing that, we're gonna stop paying your pension. So it's your choice. You can keep trying to be the american sure or you can keep your pension and he was like. I think I want the pension yeah, what a story. So what what a brain anyway, ah the trump that I was going to give PAM a little more. did what was there some offers. Anna has many. I am michael, Michael Louis as s behalf was gonna pay. Five, five billion dollars or something steal at twice the price last one. I would build a wall about the united states, so high and so secure. I say we should stop and stop now the refugees who are seeping into this country by the thousands to take the jobs which rightly belonged to the native and natural born citizens of the united states.

Here's a hint their part. Their motto was about putting merkel. First, the person who said this was divorce twice in a children with three different women affects senator for rice, Reynolds added carolina that is correct, ass in nineteen forty one, he was a monster but yeah, He wanted to. His big idea was to build a wall to keep out jewish refugees because they were going to take all our jobs and corrupt our christianity, who yeah so we've been up against worse right, I mean having an ultra right movement, ascendant in this country. That is very anti semitic that is anti democratic at its core. That is in law.

With foreign dictators that is connected to very popular people, including the most powerful industrialists and the country, Henry ford and father coglan, who is the most powerful media figure, may be an american history. People like Charles lindbergh was a consensus national hero men. All these people are pulling in that direction. While hitler is steam, rolling europe and americans, whose names we have forgotten and who are not famous, stood up against them and prosecuted them and infiltrated them an did. Amazing exposes of them and ran against them and asked them from office, and they gave us a gift of Benazir bhutto. They very hopeful note to end Yes, thank you so much rachel joining the pot again. Look, it is pretty an american fight against fascism is fantastic. Everyone go by a great covered.

Great cover, our thanks and also do listen to ultra also it's just fantastic podcast and thanks for stopping by next time, but let's not make it for years. Luckily, you can buy again love you guys. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you, Pod. Save America is a crooked media production are producers are livia martinez and David Toledo. Our associate producer is fair, safari writing support from Halley keefer reach. Ireland is our executive producer. The show is mixed in edited by andrew chadwick. Jordan. Canter is our sound engineer with

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