I do think that the work in my office and other parts of the justice department has changed the definition of the problem of crime in america who are going to have to attack it as a business, not just as individual crime. We have followed up with civil rico cases, There were some point in the future and which we will really destroy the power them off in this region. here was application. The racket you statute is probably no one knows it better than do probably some that no it as well as the first one to use it and white collar gate. But a major cases like the boasting case and the milken in case it does not make for election disputes. I mean, this is ridiculous. What she's doing. oh yeah is actually a sort of fascinating, a perfect circle. This is, of course, why Elton John would sing about and the lion king. This is the circle of life,

live by the sword, die by the sword, another way to sake as rudy who was once celebrated. for his really really Rats abuse of riga laws is now and die. under way. Yes, he is accused, along with donald trump and seventeen others, of trying to overturned georgia's twenty twenty election results, and that's his reaction is kind of excited about it good morning and well. in Joe. It is Wednesday august. Sixteen kind of halfway through the weak and waterway it has been the iron them so glad. You said that can then a mere while wanting to talk about the red saw no eye to weaken, span they're going to end up with a last place. The yankees, of course, still gonna come back to second area, is think owing down the home stretch of the dirty and winning it in record time, that's what will happen with the eighties, but for now Jonathan mere, like six, Eight five out of seven three ever begins

psychology out the guy schools, J b team, but really doesn't matter a windsor, a right red sox, doing best to get our hopes up again before dashing than Joe. This is yes, this is their emma. I was at their last night there socks or in town here in washington. They beat the gnats five for playing, ok, but yes playing a series of jamie squads on their schedule. Right now, the story, as you see, it is certainly the yankees recent struggles, but you and I know better they're playing possum. This is the long on the scene. Is we ve seen this before they are about to turn on the jets, see them at the dignity. Right down the canyon of heroes. Early november. We certainly well rip van stuff. Brenner got back from his deep long slumber break our hearts yet again, I'm sure they'll have like bucky dan leading the prayed waving. Everybody that we ve seen For what well what we're about to cover today we have never seen before since

I will ask you for a month ago, or perhaps in this spring, with this former present. Getting indicted to this dream it's happening for thai society. Jonathan liberty, of course, the white house bureau chief of politico, also thrown a big lie. Author. The big lie. He wrote about the seas, voices luxury he's watching what he wrote about my out in real life or try on a white house directorate communications under president obama, jennifer palmary joints. this morning and cheap lighthouse correspondent for the new york times. Peter baker is with us, professor, it insane university, eddie, god, junior and former. U s attorney and senior fbi. I chalk Rosenberg is with us. We ve got a lot of questions on check now morning. The clock is now taking on the ten day window that former president trumpet is eighteen. Co. Defendants have to voluntarily

turn themselves. And can you imagine this? It's really peter baker actually wrote a great article talking about how what once was just unthinkable is now becoming well tuesday and Wednesday went stays so Peter, I'm old enough. I don't think you are, but I'm old enough and in several people to show real enough, we remember exact, where we were on august, the nice night he'd. Seventy four I was driving at my grandma arms dodge dark into I think it's at the mall, upstate new york and horse new york, and news, came on radio talking about richard Nixon resigning from the white house. It was massive there. I ve no doubt then that history will recall These foreign diamonds, as as us tat you ll only out of the ordinary and and perhaps

for better or worse to be monumental. Events in american history, especially constitutional history, but you're right right now we're in the middle of the storm and these Is these shocks just keep coming, but like, like tromp a shocking, but not surprising there now exactly that's my memory to actually my first political memory is my dad holding up the paper said the giant block letters, Nixon resigns and talking about what that means for the country and in your right we are in a historic. Now we often don't think about it when we are living history, but we're living history- and this has great consequence the country we don't know we're going to go, but you're right, there's a certain surreal. quality to the idea. That is yet another week. Another indictment here we go again. It's sort of law, some of the novelty or shock values we should be shocked, is shocking to see a president charged with a crime.

Certainly assuming you, if you think he's guilty is shocking, if you think he's being unfairly charge that shocking in its own way, of course, but you get ninety one felony charges for jurisdiction for different cases. As for trials that are coming up in the next year, let's say assuming the days guess set plus by the way, and we must not forget I got a few other civil trials coming up as well, so this is going to be a professional defendant at a time when he's trying to get back into the white house- and it's just there's no roadmap, for this- has nothing to compare it to comparing to, and you know, experiencing jobs. You know me I'm starting to see from people who have steadfastly defended donald trump all along and, of course, they ve done that if they are not proud of their anti anti trumpet. You now actually say some columns even in the new york purse, seine hey come on come on Yes, it is all the Democrats fall yes, this is this now go through and they'll attack price. The when you something like

the glass and will say come on come on. Republicans, don't fall for this again Democrats put out like fifty Deborah fifty, republican canada's last year, that denied elections and republicans that we're soccer say fell far and every one of them lost in all of the all the big raises doubts. do it again and then, at the end, he concedes law can say more more people concede prosecutors are perfect, rob brought this on himself for the most part, their real. It does seem to be sort of vat. reality sinking and even among the most steadfast hardy anti anti trappers yeah that dossier breaking through that. There is a telling moment on on fox yesterday, Neil caboodle asked his programme gas. Really you think all of these are. All of these cases are biased. All of these cases are politically motivated, really all of them, and it justifies

there's so much here, there's so much and in donald trump is now staring at a twenty twenty four. Where he's going hurtling and shuttling between courtroom to rally day. There is a sense as much as he has whipped up his core base of support. Any ass, like the though his face as well, they're, not going anywhere. They believe everything. You say that other points ass, though trap is way ahead of the field, but there's some of that support is a little bit soft and there's a you're among some republicans that their tromp, even if they like trump, even think he is being railroaded somewhat. They just think it's too much there fatigued, but more than that it will prevent him from winning again and that's what I hear from republicans your washington. Even those We're probably for trump privately their concern, they're heading for a repeat of two thousand twenty: two, where, if trump's at the top of the ticket he's going to bring the rest of the party down with him, it's going to hurt them independent was swinging voters as they try to win back the senate as they try to hold on forty billion since the president Biden, one

this time round that they think that this will be another election for trot is gonna, be a net negative for party as much as its helping the primary right now. It is hard to make the case that this is gonna, that those voters are gonna break his way next year The criminal allegations should contain a pile up. and his white house tells you and, as you reported very stand at the white house understands that georgia is a swing state our earlier than they ever expected. For one reason, His name is donald trump you look at these indictments, knew also look and georgia. There is a republican civil war pole the Kosovo war going on in georgia? Yesterday, you had the governor of georgia immediately after Donald trump set under all the press conference to show how which was raised in the voting, was rig, immediately afterwards, brian camp tweeted out that it's not true. He said this

you gotta, make it tell twenty honey twenty election and georgia was not stolen. Frontier three years now. Anyone with evidence of fraud has failed to come from under oath, improve anything in a court of law. Our Actions in georgia are secure, accessible and fair and well ten to be. As long as I am governor, the future. Our country is at stake and twenty twenty four, and that must be our folk. And then of course, spread reference. Berger said. The most basic principles of a strong democracy are a key ability and respect for the constitution and rule of law. You either habit or in doubt, and if you look those too Those are the two most powerful republican leaders in this, in georgia. Somebody mistakenly say they barely squeaked by

when need twenty two for election. Now they won in a landslide and and they want a landslide in the republican primary Jennifer palmary you have and you know this- and I know I think camp weight going after donald trumps. Bs claim was so shocking when it came out as quick. We as it came out the times of when they came out because he didn't have to do it, he didn't to do it, then I would say ninety nine percent of politicians who have sat back and said its trump. Let's just letter lay out a little bit now he went in this way the governor, the republican gum Of georgia, where this case is going to be tried, went out of his way to say donald trump, sly and the secretary

state said this guy doesn't respect the kind the duration of the united states. You the respected, are you doubt I thought it was extror. Are we telling and it talks about that vied now along the road begins. I must say I want to talk to grow. Boosting yesterday I said boy. It must be. You know it must be really It is down there and why are they- this unfolding county. They should do it in and another district Gregson. Well, that's where the crimes took place in full account. I guess, but this isn't just a democratic thing in georgia, a lot of republicans better incredibly angry at what donald trump did in two thousand and twenty and how we its losing the senate for georgia, republicans you don't you I want to say yesterday you had a great colloquy. Can you mechanically between free people? I'm not sure, but you, but you on, is that right services to force and thank you for a moment. Then we know, but which

you and higher men and john meets him about Republicans and why they won't why they won't have the courage to push back and why they continue to accept tramper gonna pick their pick their moments when they are willing to take him on an individual. Just as such an interesting case, because brian camp and brad reference burger show that you can do this. I can't think of I'm done this former governor of arizona. He did to some degree, he stood up to tromp famously refuse take his phone call as he was certifying arizona votes, but in the way that brine camp and bright reference burger, really defended. Georgia really took on tromp and, like you said, may one day, one big and here s huge using when are you the geo p and you know kelly lawful,

who was briefly a senator from georgia, ran for real. I ran for election and twenty twenty david Purdue who, with senator from Georgia, he pray. area- Brian camp- they all back trump- they all lost the other papa can who you know backed up trump on his claims that he lost twenty twenty twenty one. Twenty twenty election there invited but rations berger and camp showed that there is, a way to do this. If you do it with integrity, and these two as much is progressive, laud them for what they have done to protect mock, receive their conservator, public, and so they still women. They still way in this and these primaries, but it shows there is a way to stand up to tromp within his own party. All we want

get to chuck Rosenberg on this next part event. Mark meadows is seeking to move his full in county election case to federal court donald trump, former chief Tat was indicted with him and seventeen others. Charges of attempting to overturn trumps election laws in georgia. Meadows faces, two counts and they forty one count indictment, including georgia's rico, violations and solicitation of violation of both by a public officer in a fourteen page filing Meadows attorneys defended his actions. Writing that he was merely acting in his official capacity, as trumps chief of staff His attorneys detailed arrangements for organizing oval office meetings contacting state officials on troms behalf visiting state government building in setting up a phone call, as among his duties, meadows

petition to move the case to federal court could result in a more favourable jury. Pool made up of concern but a resident, and it would almost certainly mean no cameras be allowed the court room, however funny lest his office would still likely prosecute the case. Tromp is also exe, acted to mount a similar effort, so jogged Rosenberg last night, I'm trying to listen to music on track. to unwind. Ah, you know it's like I can't. I can't watch your nose. You can't be like twenty four hours a day I like to watch the news she thus revised myself. My liver line is not listening to music and she's. Meekest starts peppering With questions about removing this state court vericourt court, scary, I said I'm lists than the music right now like, let's just let's just ledges, enjoy mobile, makes that decision yeah exactly you know what she says to me: job as well, You won't answer me out.

Ass job. I did say that she didn't say and then I checked the run down and thank god you were on at the top of sex. So I can ask you who makes this decision and what are the variables involved good quit as Mika and Joe we all have crosses to bear mine is that Jonathan earlier referred to my washington nationals as a jv team, I'm not bitter I'm going to push through it Ok, ok, there is a problem and federal code title twenty eight of the united states code that permits a federal office. And mark meadows was a federal officer when he served as MR troms chief of staff to see, to remove a state criminal case, the federal court, but there is a catch there are often is an account here is that for the case to be removed for

federal officer under indictment, an estate cord to successfully bring a petition to move at the federal court? You had to have been acting in the scope of your official duties. I think you can make argument that ensuring a fair and free alive and for a senior government official, is within the scope of you. international duty. I don't think you can make an argument that trying to over turn a fair and free election through legal means is within the scope, you're doing so. That is the gauntlet that, Mr Mitchell, this is going to need to run and anyone else who wants to make a similar emotion. I have books. I fully expect mister trump to do the same thing, but they're going to have to convince a federal judge that committing a crime seeking to overturn a fair and free election to thwart the peaceful transition of power was within the scope, their official duties, soap. There is

real motion. There is a real code. There is a real provision that, under the right circumstances, allows for this, but I think they have a very tough to travel, to make that argument. Stick here, so procedurally charge. You would go to a federal this. The judge in Georgia then be appealed. Eleven eleventh circuit then appealed to the supreme court. Would that be the procedure for this? I'm in generally, doesn't the supreme court is, of course required to take any appeal, its absence certain enumerated circumstances. But yes, that's generally the path you go to federal judge, you ask him or her to remove the case. I expect those say no, because you weren't acting with the scope of your official. Do you know where you see this from time to time there I'd, be an agent involve shooting,

and the agent was acting fully within the scope of her official duties. She was doing her job. She was applying the deadly force policy of her federal agency, but some local district attorney Charges are wants the charge that agent and state court shall petition a federal judge, the have her remove the federal court it. That petition is granted that sort of the normal set, a fax under which you might see this but wary We are committing an underlying crime very hard to that you're, acting within the scope of your official duty writing Eddie go out. We see this time and again where Donald trump has tried to get the supreme court two way and on on on his behalf, different issues and time and time again. First of all, with the election, the his funny election fraud claims,

through every one of those out, but also when he was claiming presidential privilege intense, was climbing private presidential privilege supreme court. What have none of that? So you know it to me that if Donald trump is still looking for the roberts court to help him out, and up the wrong tree, as they are conservative with a small see in this case there does not gonna get involved unless they have to do so. So what does this look like? what is this look like georgia, especially well I think you're absolutely right. In this regard, Joe, I mean, I think, part of this, the strategy it makes sense in theirs that the kind of underlying strategy as well. How do we during this out. How do we delay delay delay until we get to the election of past the election, and I think at the end of the day, that's the end game, let's get to the ballot box leslie if we win, and then maybe we can come up matters until then asked. But I think your absence,

right he's lost how many times in court, and I dont suspected, expect him to win again given given what we ve experienced up to now. I'll get the out so meanwhile, two from trump's challengers in the two thousand and twenty four republican primary, whereas yes but the latest indictment for the former president, There are now doing an inordinate amount of resources to try to few horn. This contest over the twenty twenty into a rico statute. it was really designed to be able to go after organised crime. None is to go after a political activity. and so I think it's an example of this criminalization of politics. I dont think that this is something that that's good for the country. We all heard that phone call with the former president Ben

President, at the time where he said just find me the requisite number of votes that I would need. Doesn't that feel anti american. I feel like not what a president should do. we continue to say, as I see it, which is that we see the legal system being weapon. as against political opponents as an american and unacceptable. At the end of the day, we need a better system than that. Finally, hopefully the president says we have an opportunity to restore confidence in the integrity of our department of justice. That phone call. You heard it right yes, but we've just draw different conclusions That's what you do that I'm proud of you would look manner you don't eat as want to answer the question. What he does my answer. The question here you can't and you're driving you're willing to sit back an excuse. Somebody trying to still in election calling a republican secretary of state who says I was trying to get me to throw out votes.

Public and secretary of state, said in a republican governor said and then you sit there and you claim all politicizing the process a weapon rising the process near me, why did you not fit to be present the united states? It's just really. It's really disgusting you know I, like TIM Scott and I think, he's town really talented to town with a sigh. I really people ask me who can day? Who do you think and when the domination, if prop and It is also good tips, got tips, scott tim Scott, If he does that they does, that Jim palmary, it's so maddening. They keep talking about the war. when the zation, though but as result of the justice department, Donald trump, steals nuclear secrets. Here lies d o j about turning everything back

he lies about everything he sends his workers do: try to destroy video surveillance, state that shows him moving. Those documents around with top secret classified military secrets about, clear weapons, attacks against IRAN, America's weaknesses and they go He's he's just these. trying to play the size, the process twice steel votes from millions of americans by setting up fraudulent electors to replace lactose who actually represent the millions of people. The did vote in those and swing states, and they go out and they keep pointing at that gas dangerous merrick. Darwin are you kidding me merit garland and they keep looking.

Right past, the guy you still nuclear secrets, allegedly the guy who saw military secrets I'll still say, allegedly, even though they got him dead. The right on that all of these things, it's like stars when, when are you gonna win funny. When are you gonna get serious about running for president of the united states and telling the truth about the guy you running against it? it feels like I what you see happening in iowa. It feels like a fantasy, football lake riot, like you can your arguments that you're making you might even win iowa, you might somebody might even be donald trump in iowa, but it has no bearing on what actually happened. Aim like the stakes of was of how is actually under threat and probably also little bearing on who ultimately at least, can become president of the united states. You know it really. We went to Santa said. Rico was created to go after organised crime. Yes, yes, it was

That's wife being used here, because it was a organised crime that and his eyes committed and you see Rudy giuliani talking about talking about the same thing that you see the disdain that they have for what trumpeted rudy giuliani said. Well, this is impossible. Africa knots not be used for election disputes, as if you know, as if one happened, wasn't just trying to thwart this week. Fundamental principle of what the american republic stands for, cut the sort of callousness with which republicans have treated this issue. I feel it is. You know, alongside the history, if they made with the indictments, we're going to look back on those words and worse, like TIM, what what TIM Scott, who otherwise seems to be a very honorable very John said really talented politician will be more.

History has, as you know, we saw this happening, never country. We saw not another leader bean and from you this- is Berlusconi ash bribes going on these kinds of these kinds of trials and politicians continue to back up the person who so clearly violated this fundamental precept of the of the republic in what would we? But when we think of that country, in mayor from from stealing? and then they all know he did. It all say it off. Camera all say it off camera. They know he stole nuclear secrets and will tell you that off camera and they know he tried to steal and election and a lot of them might tombs, got actually to one for their lives and hunkered down cause the mob. The donald trump sent their way could have killed them.

could have killed them and but for the work of some capital cops there's something there's some senators and probably would have been killed by these right, so they know the truth, and yet they lie about somebody, stealing nuclear secrets and trying steel, american democracy, from vampa from them from ice? It's just again There's not looking pass there. now. There lies in these bad faith, attacks the the what about I'm trying to say about, while the two tiered system of despite this deal, o J and, of course, the hunter by matter which they latch on to each and every day as or go to talking point instead of confronting dollar the man they're trying to beat in these primaries. There simply nicely none

even because they're criticising his behaviour because they apparently decided that would alienate too many of his voters, but even to make the electability argument there not need doing that to say hey, he can't win and into our earlier conversation. Yet there are those closer president via new think that joy, if any republican emerges as the g o p nominee. The president probably can't win georgia this time around. Georgia is not quite there yet for democrats, but if it's trump they like their chances so Peter baker. This is a moment. Republicans they are refused, they go after trot, but they ve got an opportunity of being one next week. First for public debate, There are a lot eyeballs on that we don't know yet trumps gonna show up. There's some population that he'll actually tat villa

to have turned himself into georgia prosecutors on Wednesday to upstage that debate. I certainly wouldn't put it past him, considering his flair for the dramatic and trying to seek attention so, but to give us your latest reporting as to whether trump might mate appearance the debate, but more than that, if the republicans organ at any point, Chris Christie, aside change tack, six and use that moment or any other to finally start taking him on

I try to remember that lesson in political science class, where they said that a good counter programming to a debate with your opponents is to turn yourself in on felony charges. I miss that we are taking a class on his. I dunno, that's a pretty new one for me, but you're right yeah. It's a really fascinating convergence of these events right where you're going to have the one guy who is the dominant figure, the dominant voice in the party who is dealing with this felony, the latest felony counts against him. At the same time, all of the others who would desperately like to get attention are going to be onstage and don't know whether he'll be there or not. I think he would like to keep us in suspense right up to the last minute. If he can it's hard to imagine well him I'll? Let you know that there'll be a stage that he wouldn't want to be on right because he's just he just loves to be on. estate, and yet, of course, as he himself has said politically, you can make. I organise stupid from your shot, because none of these people are right now it seems to be a threat to a. Why elevate them by giving them a chance to go after him, so whether they have him directly or not

The weather, onstage person are not there to talk about a man and in so far you're right. We have, as you know them anywhere other than Chris Christy's hutchinson and we'll heard. really be very critical, not mike head that my pencil hedging ill of it more into that. These days, of course, is the guy. Who himself was the top Hang my pants mob sector bye, bye, present Tromp he's been a load of more vocal lately, but even so in their lives, for how far he is willing to go, and he too is criticised some of these indictments and prosecutions. There's gonna be a really interesting moment. Peter. Thank you I just want to ask you moving forward, not only in this next nine days as we wait to see how these co defendants will turn the sell fan in fault in county, but back to the deed. the case, we know that donald trump, at least he has said. social media that he wants Have a new conference, I think monday at eleven or something and ease already blasting

these trials. Blasting. The people involved in them and content he to push election lies is. Is there anything that europe watching for in terms of how the judge, especially in DC case, may, have to face actually has to act She may it's. A great question make us. I understand that Mr Tromp has an irrefutable report for all of us. I turn and to a door side, because it really doesn't have any evidence, sherry, meaning it has no evidentiary value. The judge has a really tough path to walk in her in job is to ensure the integrity of the judicial process. to make sure that both sides, not just the defendant, not just the government, but that both sides get a fair trial whose both are entitled to a fair trial, she's gonna, give MR trump some rope. He is going to be permitted.

Talk about the election and that it was stolen, though this is a broad and that the Democrats are targeting handed it to which, on all that is both protected political speech. It's fair game have at it what she's not going to permit him to do and there's, as I said, a number of different ways she can enforce it does to intact witnesses. the tamper with evidence right to do things to impede the efficiency. In fairness of the course that's where she starts to put the hammer down and there are ways to do it bright, making a soap she can issue a gag order is not something she's done yet and is probably not something she wants to do, but she can issue, it was she does, and MR trump doesn't abide it. She can find him in contempt their civil contempt and there's criminal content, and there are I tell you that attached to both of those things, let's say that doesnt work, the process,

I just have a tool, they have their own arrow in their quiver. We saw the indictment in the southern district of florida. The federal indictment of the concerning documents at mar a lago was superseded with the no counts of obstruction of justice and a new additional counts. Charging MR trump we're trying to have security footage destroyed if he tempers Witnesses if he goes after witnesses, you might well see a superseding indictment in the district of columbia. That say separate stand alone federal crime, so he is entitled to speak but there are certain things, as the judge said, he's not entitled to speak about his like any other defendant and if he goes over the line and is inclined to do that. There are a series of measures she can take and prosecutors can take again.

Back on the right side of that line, really interesting stuff really hard for a judge to do this, it is quite literally unprecedented. I think judge shotgun is up to the task in and chuck. Finally, I just want to underline something that you said yesterday. every day we we're back calder or people reaching out. Are we see ourselves the ease these attacks against rule of law, these attacks against cases against prosecutors, against the judges and and and people were asking well. What is it me was want to he's, gonna get away with it. I just We underline again that where it we're just in a completely different we're on a completely different stage at this point and what politicians say what pundits say

pollsters may tell you about what americans think about this, what pine, asters, say what cable news just doesn't matter its irrelevant. The only thing that matters it's kind of like you know when I a team goes on the football field. The only thing that matters is what happens on that football field. For those sixty minutes, press conferences, people can talk, but talk is cheap. Can you once again explained donald trump can say whatever he wants to say they entered the. He's gonna be judged inside that court room inside that jury box and nobody Can it be there to help him but his lawyers and that's it me right, Joe, so right to your analogy, in baseball and football. It's what happens between the lines. Lots of people talk about lhasa thing, before the game starts. Half of them are right and half of them are wrong, but had what matter

This is what happens between the lines cheer. The lines are the well over courtroom really forecourt rooms, and what I think I mentioned the other day is that there are people whose opinions matter and it's really the forty eight jurors twelve in each of forgery, courtrooms that are going to render a verdict in these cases about MR trump co defendants by the way. What I really worry about, not so much the attacks on prosecutors, I was a prosecutor. I've been attacked. It's ok It's kind of roles off your back, I've, never in a judge, but judges have been attacked. I imagine they know how to handle it. When I read we truly worry about are attacks witnesses and something we haven't discussed attacks on co, defendants, raiment Mr trump said: if you come after me, I'm coming after you, interestingly, You haven't seen any co defendants split off, yet you haven't

anyone plead guilty. Yet you haven't seen anyone agreed to cooperate yet when you indict nineteen people that normally happens, and maybe it's the signal not just to the judges and prosecutors. The way we ve traditionally interpreted it but to his co defendants you stand line or I come after you that steeply dangerous there will be verdicts at the end of the day they will be rendered in court. By jurors ordinary citizens drawn from the community. Those are the opinions that matter. We will hear those opinions one day, chuckle burke thank you very- I really appreciate it thanks for being on again worthily. Yes, that is getting some answers. Still I had on morning Joe Senate majority. Later chucks tumor is our guest this morning, we'll get him action to dial trance newest indictment. This one out of georgia for learning more about the evidence collected by the special council in the federal election interference case and the quote momentum,

steps taken by twitter to protect donald trump also, I had one hundred bindings attorneys has stepped down but will still play pardon me tat all case against the president's on what is to fight for the problem lies on and will have the latest on the devastating maui wildfires that growing death tall and the search for survivors what's your morning, job will be right back

Hi, I'm jennifer, palmary and unclear mechanical, where the hosted the innocent bc podcast how to win twenty twenty four. We both know first hand that winning an election is hard and having been in and around tough races for most of our don't lives. We have some unique insights into what it will take to win this twenty twenty four election and some crazy stories to share to listen to how to win twenty twenty. Four now

amazon. Music, new episode stir, says: hey it's crises, this we're gonna park ass, wise is happening. Keep map news founding executive, editor, Robertson, Meyer on the year in climate, fossil fuels actually have been enormous for human flourishing. They have unlock a tremendous amount of prosperity and wealth and health for people, especially in western europe and north america, but all around the world as well- and you know what you know so- did the typewriter. So did oil lamps. They were a tremendous technologies, they did a ton of good and then we develop better stuff and that's what we need to do in order to fight climate change and in order to get to where we need to be that this week, and why is this happening? Social wise is happening wherever you're listening right now, unsubscribed a threat of devastating wildfires. some of which are still burn in hawaii clay.

The lives of ninety nine people. So far clean things up yet the deadliest, while far more than a hundred years, whole city destroyed, generations of native hawaiian history turned into ruin. I've spoken a governor judge gary mobile time, Are you sure you in the state will have everything you need to? The federal government is pace if you were to takes time and its nerve racking most of the re can't be removed from the start. my wife jill and I are going to travel to hawaii as soon as we can that's what I've been talking to the governor about it. I don't want to get in the way, too many disaster areas. but I want to go make sure we get everything they need President Biden yesterday in wisconsin speaking about the maui wildfires, where more than one hundred people are now confirm to be dead. Red cross says more than four thousand people are. hacked into nearly a dozen shelters. In the wake of the destruction

yesterday, mowing county began to identify those who died and we're learning more about the harrowing stories of citizens trying to flee the fire or protect family members. Hawaii the governor says, the wildfires are likely the worst natural disaster in the history of the state, and in some other news this morning, ok attorney for hunter by will no longer represent in the new york times. Reports attorney Christopher Clark stepped down yesterday after revealing he intends to testify, as a witness on behalf of the president's son, A court rules in delaware prohibit clark from being a witness advocate. Clark represented hunter by in plain negotiations to end a five year, justice to buy an investigation and attacks and gun offences, but a job delayed that deal pleader plea talks

broke down, meaning the case would likely have to go to trial, will continue to follow this stuff. And overseas north korea has confirmed publicly for the first time that u S, army, soldier, Travis king crossed into its territory a statement from the state run. Korean central news agency claimed king headaches. Pressed his willingness to seek refugee status in north korea. U s defence officials said. The king wilfully end without the relation crossed into north korea in July, while taking a severe tour of the deed, militarized zone, and coming up one of donald trump, donald trump. Fourth indictment now looms over the first republican debate next week. Will the jail beef, Runner show up, despite is mounting legal trouble, will explain straight on morning, job

the one on Tom yarmouth from top story on NBC news now, every night top story is your news playlist we take you to the front The story words actually happening with envy Jordan, journalists on the ground from all over the world recover. What you need to know bring your news feed to life and now top stories available as a podcast, so you can listen anytime and anywhere subscribed now for new episodes every week today's news requires more facts, more context and more analysis. The world's never been harder to understand. That's why it's even more important to try and this b c, understand more. When was up a point like that, He talks about words that I said eleven years ago. I think it's just go and I think she should be ashamed of yourself if you want to know the truth

my god, that's from deflecting from his own troubles, but a president debate in october. Twenty sixteen just two days after the access hollywood take was you seem so that gap is donald trump as John. How moses but done trumpet is always confession or projects our next year. Just looking at how trumps current troubles are weighing over the republicans first presidential debate now, just days away. The piece by senior columnist, Matt Lewis, is entitled showing up to the G. O p debate would be the ultimate trump flex, and it reads in part, for normal politician. One indictment would be cause to go into hiding and avoid interrogation by a debate, moderator and attacks. By ambitious fellow paul's, but remained Tromp is not a normal politician, and just as there as president for trumped to skip a primary debate. The results

precedent for him to exploit a political debate in an effort to move past a damaging scandal by saying outrageous things and steam Lange his opponents case. In point trunk turned out to be incurred. We're lucky that a presidential debate occurred in october. Ninth, twenty sixteen just two days after the access hollywood story broke. Now, it's likely that whoever linked to the access hollywood video thought they were delivering the delivering the coup de graf by virtue of their impeccable timing, but it had the exact, opposite effect? The debate, ironically, helped draw attention away from the scandal which had pretty slave dominated the new cycles. No, no a person could have pull this off, but instead of being ashamed or contrite, trump went on offence against

Hillary Clinton immediately. These men lose joins us now that we have any glowered junior with us and he has the first question atlanta. opportunity the reader to reject article and he's really insightful, but we are in this moment twenty twenty three. Do you think if he's gets on stage will it be the same donald trump. I understand what you say they do, but with Chris Christy, focusing on him as opposed to rubia and others. Would you think it would be as effective Could he bring the same show at this stage clinical career as it were, my do they Chris Chris. is kind of the x factor and I'm curious to see if dot prop is afraid of Chris Christie, so afraid of crisp christie that he doesn't show up that he uses excuses such as I'm not going to sign the pledge. The orange his pledge were whether donald trump just an egomaniac who craves attention who loves attention

and who now feels that he has a bigger chip on his shoulder has to another worden himself and play the victim again. That issue up in the law and I think I'm leaning toward the ladder. He may not fully appreciate that the danger that Chris Christy's specifically poses and look, I think, there's another Google argument for why from might want to show up. We ve already seen that the republicans are loath to protest I am in a back there supporting him and these indictment, but there is no winning. I think for someone like our rhonda santa's, for example, to say, look donald Crop is the victim of Democrats who are trying to criminalize the political process. But, let's be honest, he as these foreign diet theirs the way he's gonna, be able to run an effective campaign next year and the general election having to appear

in court in florida in new york in atlanta and all that after trump shows up, and I think the biggest flax would be to turn himself. Then you'd have surrender himself and then go to the debate. I think truck shows what I can walk and shoe gum at the same time. And so I think, if you add that an unjust his compulsive need for attention, I think he shows such than a mere I'm get. I'm gonna take the other side of it. I do with it he's scared of Chris Christie. He said What chris Christie did Marco rubia when Chris Christie, when a debate with one thing in mind: he knows Chris Christie put Jared kirshner father in jail for a very long time, he knows, he's a prosecutor whose If watson knows how powder tat pushes case- and he also knows that

sacred sauce and twenty. Sixteen was being the disruptor shaking Hillary Clinton up on the debate stage, shaking the marco's. And everybody else upon the debate stage that gag that's it eight years old right, that's all since seventy seven now I do think Chris he's got his number, and he knows I jump from its get the gardens they got me. Sleaze political got. An instinct is second to none, like he sees a common, and so I just don't, I I think he's scared the kurds christie and will not have the guts. go or the nerve to go on stage with Chris Christie anywhere.

A person in trump's orbit a few days ago. Told me when you know the decision is not yet made. If trump is going to go to this debate, he said well, an argument to not go would be that. Well then, Chris Christie, trains, his sights on Ronda santas and a finishes him off. They're well aware of christie's strengthen the debate, stage we should also crisscrossing has not yet qualified for the second republican debate show of trump wants to set this one out. Maybe he can show up on the debate stage. A few weeks later not have to deal with Christy Matt Lewis of you know. I was there at twenty sixteen for that debate and when the our trunks showed up for eight hours out the x. I would take with a number of women It would accuse the Clinton's of inappropriate conduct. In the years passed it was stunning he changed the new cycle, you documented it. He was able to get steady himself, but he also had some help back then the conservative media. Clearly at that point you know it you know has been was with him in his with member states and curse to how you view them now, because

many of the outlets. Fox news included seem to flirting. We had flurry with other candidates Do you sense now that they are fully back on tromp or that keeping their options of because it so that cancer of ecosystem has been so vital to his rice, yeah They are largely with them. There's a tent you should have a danger, I think that they could leave em and maybe that that's another Reason the trumpet wanna show up at the debate. I look if you logical, he might not show up at the debate right. You can argue trunk salem up by forty coins. Let's, let everyone attack round the santos instead of me. I just think he's guided more by things like fear and the craving at the time and any more he feels it is back, is against the law and it doesn't have to be politically could be legally. I think that that will drive him to lie to turn. And two, why I think he has one of these debates.

Maybe he should be afraid of Chris Christie, I'm not sure they actually has that enough. Well, it also depends on you know exactly how They carry out the debate. There's gonna be a candidates on stage. Is it going to be an actual debate or is to be framed in a way were trump can own the narrative and talk people talk over people talk through timelines and it isn't a debate. It could be a good Eight opportunity for him, given the way he likes operate. I disagree. I think he'll show up. I also if he tries to say oh, I won't girl because of the loyalty pledge that sort tromp saying I don't think I'm gonna be the nominee, so I'm not sure that's gonna fly I ultimately ends up showing up will say what happened. Senor columnist for the daily beast Matt Louis, thank you for joining us, his bases online now,

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