Today's episode features #1 Robert Caro superfan, Conan O'Brien.
The Power Broker by Robert Caro is a biography of Robert Moses, who is said to have built more structures and moved more earth than anyone in human history. And he did it without ever holding elected office. Outside of New York City, Robert Moses wasn't exceptionally well known. Inside of New York, he was mostly accepted by the media as simply the man who built all those nice parks. But The Power Broker, which is subtitled Robert Moses and The Fall of New York, changed all that. It is a tour de force of journalism, history, and biography. Roman also argues it's really fun to read and is strongly in contention for the best book ever written.
But there is something of a catch, which can hang readers up: the book is a daunting 1200 pages long. As influential and amazing as this bestseller is, many people own an unopened copy gathering dust on their bookshelf. But that is a crime because this book needs to be read or at least discussed at length on a podcast.
Roman Mars and Elliott Kalan (Flop House, Daily Show) are starting The Power Broker book club that will run through all of 2024 as bonus episodes and in this introductory episode, Conan O'Brien joins us to talk all things Robert Caro.
Breaking Down The Power Broker
This is an unofficial transcript meant for reference. Accuracy is not guaranteed.
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This is ninety nine percent, invisible, I'm roman mars.
in nineteen. Seventy four to very significant things happened. If you are a fan of ninety nine percent, invisible number one is that I was born
and number two the power broker by robert kara was published
I learned about the power broker when I first started to cover cities and infrastructure on the radio. This massive book, that's about twelve hundred pages long, is the most important income
The explanation of how cities are formed, how neighborhoods or destroyed ridges
reckon roads are laid down, parks or designed. Fortunes are made, lives are ruined and power is amassed. It is
biography of Robert Moses, a man who has said
built more structures and move more earth than anyone,
in human history, and he did it all without ever holding elected office
outside of new york city robert, most
wasn't exceptionally well known inside of new york. He was mostly
I'm criticised by the media and was simply the man who built all those nice parks, but Robert Cairo's book, the power broker, which is
idled robert moses and
fall of new york changed all that it is a tool
force of journalism, history and biography. I also think
is really fun to read and is strongly and contention for the best book ever written
ms, as I mentioned, it is twelve hundred pages long
as best selling and his influential as it is. I wouldn't
surprised if you had an unopened copy sitting on
Bookshelf right now, but that is a crime, because this book needs to be read, or at least disgusted
but upon cast so willing to spend twenty twenty four reading it together we're going to study it, we're gonna break it down we're going
to exult in the genius of the author, Robert Caro, within a sheep, are fixed in the sky at Robert Moses. It is going to be amazing and, as
I was discussing this idea with my friend Elliot Kalen, who is the co host of the pioneering very funny flophouse podcast and former head writer of the daily show with John stewart his eyes lit
and he said if there is any
for me to be involved. I would love to help and later
day. He texted me a picture of the title page of his.
Copy of the power broker that was signed by robert kara himself
He was a guest on the daily show when I was working there any signed it and he said to elliot
Another member of the writing profession, Robert carol,
The greatest compliment I've ever received in my life is like just thinking about it.
Was crying like this. It didn't like the first time, a red. It was just that I could even pretend to be a right
Like Robert kara was this amazing dislike it?
control yeah it's from
the point of view, there's two really big
since. To read this book, the power broker and in one is
that it's about rob moses, who is a person that
most people wouldn't know if it wasn't rubber care who shaped the twentieth century in so many ways and the other
Robert kara himself, the writer. So, let's start with Robert kara, why
Getting that note from him make you cry
there's a and yet did maybe cries had almost new private was true. I can only say that robert carol represents.
To me anything to a lot of people. Read em this amazed.
synthesis of the
just researcher who ever lived. He has this
it's down and he will not stop until he is as
and out every single piece of information it's possible to find out about the subject. You will talk to everybody. You'll talk the multiple times
every page in the archives, but combined with that is reduced
and it's not just information, but the books are beautiful. Your beautifully written he's array,
who manages to combine this intense
actual rigorous with a real sense of power,
tree and beauty and evocative writing that's hard to find so
and I are gonna co host this deep dive into the power
and I want to say that we do not expect you to have read or know anything about the book. At this point, we just want to convince you to take this journey with us and
we'll make it so that you can enjoy it and listen. Even if you don't read it but is really worth
if you do and in addition to elliot we're going to have many fun guests in the
What club with us that you're going to meet along the way? But first I want to talk
the origin of this book and how Robert kara first got
idea of writing about this man, robber moses
Robert kara was first the reporter
the nineteen sixty four newsday robber Moses was still the monumental towering figure in new york city politics. He was the man behind the parks he's the man who builds parks. He builds bridges, he builds roads and he were-
to build this enormous bridge across the long island soundness and called the oyster bay rye bridge, because at this point like
one who is currently trying to challenge themself. He just wants to build bigger and bigger bridges, regardless of where they're are going who's gonna. Take them easy, it's just for the bridge for the purity of the bridge itself, which in a way is kind of beautiful, but which is terrible for the people living on island and Robert Kara.
is a journalist in his day and he's doing a series
stories about this bridge. He talks about it and all them tell him. This is a bad idea,
bridge was too big it
it is not necessary. It's gonna disrupt, will probably
hidell patterns and things like that. That's how big the pete the pillars are, the peers there, the folded up and run
characters writing articles about it, and he goes. I think, I'm really making a difference. I'm really making a change here and he goes
to the meeting where the approval, as can be voted on to move forward with this bridge, and he goes there and not
I'll get off the bridge sales through the approval process. So fast and
rick starts realise, as he
more about municipal governance. O this bridge is not
built there because of engineering needs. Demographic needs planning needs its being built there because
Moses wants it built there and he has enough power that he can say
I want this here, even if it flies in the face of
all observable reality in summer there and rubber terraces. How did this guy get this power because the seat, the thing that roses? He was never elected or public office democratically, according to our system here
No one should have his power, but he certainly should not have it has never been the one time he ran for office. We runs for governor, he loses.
A landslide because he is such an unlike up of so many people, but somehow ramos. This has this power in so Robert kara says on the write a book about this. He tells us wifi anna. It will take
nine months and write a book about Robert Moses, a yearly
he's like. I'm
scratch the surface of the research process, and it takes him seven years to to write this book during that time.
Wife cells, their house and they move to an apartment set. They continue working on it through bit their living
their living really hand to mouth, and this is
the shortest I think he's ever spent on a book creature. Seven years since then, after this is a success, he goes on to outline a johnston. He's right. These huge books nets, the work of his life for the past forty some odd years, and so is it the one she
The thing about Robert Caro is that he is the great
to these writers and the flip side of him being so great and so thorough with it is that he will.
if writing about two people for his entire life, but that's how he gets into this thing. He
since that Robert Moses has this power. How did he get it when he shouldn't have it and that
the question that leads him to this book and it takes him eleven hundred pages. To answer it, and, to be honest, is heartbeat.
It would take less than that. Legally, there are eleven hundred eat well used pages you're it really
stunning as a as a work, because I came into this through.
He stayed in cities and how their made, not necessarily like sort of like thinking too much about the character of raw?
moses. But it is a real shakespearian, greedy myth, kind of
hero and tragedy and fall like eight really has all these beats as a story that are beyond just
You know me y understand how cities are made YAP rhetoric. Harrow manages to take the act of construction in the act of road planning and the effect it has on
people and how much of it stems from the personality of this one man and really blows it up into this epic proportion, because these are epic things he the point he's making throughout the
is Robert Moses is literally reshaping the the actual landscape of new york city and much of the
our state? It is physically,
building more and putting more earth into movement
than any other human being has in the end
the world and all behind the very innocuous title of perks. Commissioner, you know- and courage
shouldn't coordinator and its because, while this epoch story
Is is mirrored by this very macchiavelli.
Behind the scenes story of the man who can work the law and knows how to write laws and how to fix them so that he can do things
fire power without people, knowing that they can work behind the scenes. I should mention the bridge that Robert cairo saw get passed through. The apple,
process was never actually built because the planning of that bridge managed to
if coincide with these
experian fall of Robert Moses from the heights that he had attained. So if you want to go drive across the oyster bay ripe rage, all six miles of this spencer bridge, don't worry you're, not gonna able to do it. I'm sorry! It's not going to happen so this book, the power
girls has been around for fifty years and it is a very fine book. It is actually really lie.
We to read
understand and learned so much. The chapters are just there is almost whiplash between the chapter, sometimes like rubber.
There'll be talking about how this one road is built and how much it took to raise the money for it and then the next chapter is about him and his in dutch,
We will have to put this brother and it's it's. It's a whiplash bits. Also Robert kara has this. Has this amazing sense of this? I ve got a lot of fun
it's about road building right now. I don't know if I'm ready for more facts about road building. Okay is a chapter about Robert Moses and his brother, oh you're, not this chapter off blade.
It was really dance with his relationship with a different mares. Ok, let me give you a chapter about how lavishly he would entertain his guests at jones, beach less if he was an emperor and then in europe,
that trapping like this is fine. This is funded. Lit like this is like great gatsby kind of like you know,
I and asserted, but then robert growth,
like you enjoyed that chapter. Didn't you here's a chapter about how an entire neighborhood was destroyed and they tried everything they could to stop it and he couldn't stop it in it's heartbreaking and it's such a there's such a a masterful kind of flow to it
there's funny parts to it and there's Robert carries the master of a as ending a chapter,
with a one sentence- paragraph that's like but robert most
I had an idea and that's the end of the chapter and you're like now. I need to read the next chapter, like it's rare, that
today. A really weighty, really respectable tom about me
simple governance that has so much suspense
built into it, s only cliff hangers
The thing about it is a very I read from the book out loud
to my wife and it's really readable, like it just a kind of raw
of the tongue really. Well, it's not this relentlessly com
logical slog of like yeah. Ok, we have to get to this bridging into this bridging into this bridge really is about how Robert Moses developed as this kind of political reformer. This progressive.
anti politicians, sort of meritocracy, focus,
this guy who went into public service for all the right reese just because he saw a need that people had for that away.
to get around especially better ways to relax and enjoy their lives in a city setting and you watch him,
Asked the power he needs to make that dream possible and
Robert Rebecca calls it a dream many times to make
impossible and then realize. Actually, I kind of like the amounts,
power part like making the dream of a small part of, and going too far, that it's the
it's. The real story is that you want them
the only moment it doesn't have is the moment every rock and roll movie where someone goes you've changed man. It used to be about the music, but that's the kind of the kind of arc that rubber most is going on. There's just so much
there's a there's, a character in.
in the novel, the moonstone by working collins, who carries around robinson
with them everywhere. Lady says this is my bible, I'd whenever
advice for I need to add something. I turned to a page, robinson crusoe and there's something right there for me and that's how I feel about the power broker. Then I could, if I had trouble with something my life I feel like. I could open up the powerbroker to a random page and I'd find something on there. That would be or be like the supplies,
Let me get through it, but I'm getting to right. Now. I've read it once before and
red ones before were reading any again for the project of this podcast witching hour, you
for ass may be part of this because for years I said, I'm gonna reread the power broker sunday, but went on
I get around to it and then this came along and I was like yeah now. I am justified in rereading spending the limited amount of time. God put me on. There's this earth rereading the longest book. I think I've ever read
So this is our names members will product for this next year and
sorting on january nineteenth and monthly,
sort of cover about a hundred pages per month and get through the whole book and
We're gonna talk about what happened in the book of recap. It we're do some deep.
Ives into something we find most interesting in those chapters, maybe not the most important thing to something too. To pick a part, that's fun for us and work
interview, some celebrities, who are fans of Robert Caro fans,
ro moses mean whatever
interested and rubber moses. I guess more than fans of Moses
events in the same way that someone's like, like really likes the joker, definitely amory. Something like that and including our first
for this inaugural. I grew episodes introductory episode. A one code-
o brien, who is sort of like
amazing. How he's aligned himself with Robert kara like there's a whole near times article from a few years ago, about how much he is
fan of Robert Carroll, which is what is going to amazing thing to exist. You know that there will just be an article about his own fandom, one of the first
and I remember, reading about rubber kara, was in an article about conan, o brien from twenty summit.
Years ago. You could tell he's supposed to be talking to somebody about being
the host of a late night television show that the article opens with him talking about master of the Senate, which at the time I think, was the most recent Lyndon Johnson book in a serious, and you can tell that he's just so genuinely excited about this that it had. He must have brought it up, probably thirty times that they
put him in a once in the article that they're like what we gotta cover discus. It's such a part of him. His ease, such even such a real carol, had
It's just a real kara die hard for years. Its funding.
Can be such an enthusiastic fan, and so
as the only guess that we had in mind for our first episode. So after the break
he and I are gonna talk to coded o brien.
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We're gonna, spend the whole year digging into the power rover. But first, let's talk about the guy who wrote it in addition
to the power broker. Robert care
has written a memoir about his writing and for biographies of presently.
and Johnson, with a fifth and final book on the way, each volume
taking on a different portion of l b jays life with signal
digressions on these
The composition of the texas he'll country were johnson, grew up and the entire history and function of the: u S, senate, as a biographer,
there is no one like em and, as such robber carol has a fur.
And and dedicated fanbase, including Conan O'Brien, so
You created gunnar brain needs. A friend I am told, based
is an elaborate front to get robert care to talk to you
Why is he so special
what forceful everything I've done in show business is an elaborate long con
to achieve, saw my life goals.
Meeting mister t was one of them and
chief? That way,
in the late nineties, but I've
We wanted to talk to Robert Caro, I'm a history buff,
And so Robert cairo, clearly v pre eminent.
Historian of our time.
And I have very good friend
in college, roommate name Eric rife, shut out eric
I still see all the time and
he and I were in car.
Which, together, when these first, the first
a book on Johnson came out and we started reading those books as they came out and we
sort of. If you can imagine back fifteen
years ago, if you can imagine twice
four year old girl
waiting in line for the next harry potter book. That's how we were about about kara,
and we were
long animated discussions about Lyndon Johnson and so
to the point where we will be in a restaurant me to this day. We could be talking about Lyndon Johnson and restaurant, and-
My friend Eric, is very loud and also if
in the same part of pennsylvania that Jimmy stewart's from
so he actually sounds a bit like Jimmy stewart and so
who will be in a restaurant like a nice restaurant and we start talking
about johnson and Eric
get very animated and then I'll get animated but erics louder than I am, and I'm the one on television and radio and he'll star shouting you don't you, you know what I thought about
well then drops from yonder you're going to understand and you'll kill people think that it's a scene from you know it's a wonderful life, our
screaming at clarence, so people
very excited about the work of robert care and
I think it all boils down to me
core religion, even though I was raised catholic, my real core religion is that god is in the details
I feel that way about comedy. I feel that way about work and crew.
in general and run
care o is the
patron saint of doing the work
in the time having the patients
and believing that god is in the details and that's reflected so powerfully in his work that I think that's why he resonates for me. I I
it's really fascinating- that people are obsessed with his process and an a view you've expressed. Expressing obsessed with this process may think that part. That is because, in the end,
in the void of the decade between books. We fill it our imaginations with with with you know him
a single light bulb and file folders
stuff like this in an era, is even in his book that talks about writing is called working. It's all! Yes, it's about a work ethic. What? What about that? It's really fascinating to you
well, I I like to contrast Robert Caro with fatah
since that were in now. You think about it. Everything so quick
everything feel some temporary
when the internet,
didn't exist when Robert carers started
clearly the power broker, but then on to his Lyndon johnson books,
I now we live in this world where everything so ephemeral and fast, since
he's, come and go television comes and goes, entertainment things
almost like a magician that has flash powder things explode in there's a big,
melba, woe and it puffin, and it's gone
and while this is all happening, you contrast
What this man, who has Derek
his whole life assent
really to writing about these two people.
And really most of his life right
one man and
in his way, without
per mise very quietly
small office having been there, but imagine it's not huge and
cranking away on a smith, corona typewriter that was built
nineteen sixty nine and
has this dedication to
he's doing that
feels like its akin to egyptians, building a pyramid.
In a most people that were working on a pyramid, never even lived to see it half built letter
one completed what this man's doing doesn't feel like it's part of the late twentieth.
An early twenty first century is completely out of time. You know
Albert cairo in his work makes me
a trivial. The way
looking at a mesa in a desert makes me
trivial. You know I just look at it like. Oh, my god, this thing is so much bigger than me and made of granite robert care.
the closest thing to like a geological formation. His work, his body of work, feels like were watching. This error
of lava that takes an end and moving of tectonic plates. That's going to build something and it's gonna last
as long as civilization last, which is at least another forty years yeah. I often think of a robert carroll, less as a writer and more as like and like a merlin type carol.
Someone who goes off into into the top
a tower grower or sits on a mountain somewhere and is so incredibly folk,
and concentrated on the universe around him out his working with that. He gave
a greater knowledge of it and a key
really comes down from the mountain and is like here you go,
here's my latest insights and then he goes back up the mountain people, though mister kara,
Mr Karel. When, when do we have more of this and he's like it takes time, it takes time it hits concentration more than your capable of and then and then goes back up into the mists of is office on central park west. I guess right and
You know he has such respect, for the work is done,
that he wears a blazer and a tie isn't working,
anybody, my himself all day is by himself. You know I would be probably just
wearing board shorts
No wonder where I don't look at me, a short less and I'd be
and you know yelling into an ancient dick to phone just for fun and the tv would be in the background and I'd be making popcorn, but this guy is dry
does if he's going into the oval office for a meeting, and he has
process, he writes
long hand. Then he writes
The typewriter and it's gotta be
we'll space and ah,
does a lot of thinking before he writes me thinking
this world or in now where we pick up our phones,
we blast out these.
screens and thoughts in various
musings with our food
and we're driving and balancing coffee and are in our
in our lab and
and if you listen
children in the back seat at the same time, doing the rounds, yeah yeah or if your me shouting at children through the window,
just children on the
You older
you seem too young to exist here. So here's a twelve hundred book reed.
Book. Yeah grew a little just hireling copies of it at the cat yeah I've did I've made a device it. I load up this little catapult thing in my car and it has
about I have but fifteen power broke
and when I see kids I want to say under twelve on the side of the story,
just loitering. I fire power broker out them on which, if you, if you ve wade that book recently
how I kill? Half these kids. Yet you have to do it then, because there are still you know, impressionable clare
like you can still turn them into human beings. They can. They can take a hit in the face of fire, usually usually yeah. They heal they'll, get over it and they'll never walk right again, but they'll know damn it. They'll read that book, but then I just admire
which admiration for his process and am always trying to feel this. Get this sense of what
What is it about this? Guy that I like? I want to try
emulate nervously, obviously they're. So in so many ways I can't emulate him, but what I, but what can emulate, is it's important
the importance of your work. Taking your work seriously, even if its
very silly work too.
it seriously and and respecting the
people who might see it or appreciated enough to try and put a little detail
into utter, a little thought or feel out he's gonna come across because when I finally
did get to meet him and talk to him,
There is a real sweetness about him it.
enthusiasm near
So many of us are pleased with
Much less but he's a little like a
because that same kind of nope.
Gonna keep going and I'm gonna keep going and I'm gonna keep going until I literally cannot stop
and you see him in his books imminent
story about
still don't have it. I still don't have the full sense
of Lyndon johnson relationship with his dad as young man. So you know talk to
in johnson's brother, SAM Houston many times, and he said he's just told all these stories and he's got
I nope, I gotta, go back. I gotta go back, I gotta go back and then find
when he gets this this brother to say you know,
ah
yeah, I was wrong
stories. I told wasn't right,
what happened and then he gets him to go back into that room where they used to sit and have dinner, and he pushes him in
wash em and pushes em and finally gets.
brother to relive that moment,
between Lyndon Johnson and his father and summits.
This folksy bullshit tall texas
hail, it's real and any
even if we consider ourselves perfection or people who care about our work
We would assigned off
long ago. What is it like? You know, we ve got a pretty good book here S, a pretty good, I think we're good and I really do want to go to aruba and make their cause. I bought the tickets, so I think I can submit this and no, he needs to
going back and keep going back and keep going back, and I keep thinking about that old. Tell it
and classic colombo. You know Peter focused
about just kept coming back. You know, he's he's talked to the bad guy thirty five times and then is like just one,
I think, is just this one dang. I want to ask yeah it's kind of confusing, and I think that is Robert kara.
Not a trench coat and he's already talked to you know
nor connally
seventy five times or is already talking to SAM. He is generous. Already too, you know he's already talk to the texas oil guy five hundred times.
and then the guy's getting dressed
the day and he wants to go out and he's got a tennis match he's supposed to play and he opens the door and there's robert caro in a trenchcoat. You know this. There's one thing that kind of bothers me just a little bit
well, what is it? Caro
curious, you said, but you know I looked into it and they
didn't have a buicks feel ashamed to clean the fort worth time. Ok, ok, it wasn't a buick dealership. It was upon
you know, and then he's got his chapter but
will not be another like him and he's on the plane.
Right now he's working right now as work, I think about, and sometimes in oslo undoing round doing whatever dumb podcasting were
Whatever thing I'm doing, I'm like
charles sitting in his office right now, while one
I'm doing this workings
hard doing something so amazing their story in the power broker, where Robert mode
his mom reason, newspaper article that says he
fined for breaking the law and she says: oh he's, never made a dollar in his life and now we're going to have to pay for this too, and his editors like well. How do you know she said that and he's like? Oh well, I talked to the the guy
delivered the newspaper to her at the camp choosing at that the summer camp she it well. How did you talk to him? I talked to everyone.
Could find to work that summer camp any end as if that was just well. Why wouldn't you weren't? You
to every single person who ever worked at the place. Our most his parents used to spend their summers like its astounding, its astounding. You don't you
gave me an idea which is we should we should all go
together and try and convey
and to do this, but this should be a robert carol, cam
and it was set up in the corner of his office and it won't bother.
Because of these, but basically for people like us, we can
at any time that he's in his office from whenever from eight o clock in the morning till six o clock at night
any of us at any time can see him sitting there. Looking at his psmith, corona or maybe typing
and on and then looking through some papers, and then
well, it's time for him to walk up through central park south back to his
apartment. I dunno what the subscription rate as for that I paved monthly for it with my children
the yell at me to get off of it as it is. My kids are always annoyed that I'm time at the power broker anyway
and carrying around with me like it's like a like a totem, but when it did that such an it
vanessa idea, and we can point the camera. So you can't see his
What and bored with his notes on these very private about those does want to see those we would respect his privacy. We would angle it he would say,
believe me
with sign off on the shot yeah, and then they just be couple thousand nerds all across the world would be watching, of course, in other parts of the world you have to get up
at three in the morning yeah. I feel like the world to to to to watch an older gentleman think, while looking at a typewriter, if you miss it, people put the setlists up. What he did was
I am, he ate a sandwich it at his desk right,
if you ve ever checked out like the book of kells
ah obscure to dublin
gotta, I think it's trinity universe,
city, and they have the book of kelson
about the middle ages and you think about the dark ages and and monks that
I did. Ok, the world is gone insane, the worlds
absolutely mad, so
a retreat,
to these little monasteries
We can get some food and we get enough word to two and coal to keep ourselves warm and we're gonna to it off, because this
madness out there there's visigoths and hans, and
horrible nests and disease and work
to us. Slowly, eliminate a bible amber,
put so much work and care, and our industry and
craftsmanship into
making these beautiful books and transcribing some of the wisdom.
It may be, is currently being lost enough
from athens, from ancient athens or from rome and
one's ever going to know our names and
I do this
we're all going to die anonymously, but we're gonna have faith that somehow this stuff is gonna, live on and that's the same view
I get it's the belief that things are more important than you and that they cannot live you and that your
matters, and those are sort of, I think
essential almost fell.
A call or religious
de as it sets its faith based.
Which is I'm going to devote my whole life to something
Doesnt seem that sexy
anybody else, I'll write about this. Basically, this civil servant and then I'll write about you know linden.
some of those books first start to come out. I remembered thinking Lyndon Johnson yeah, it's not first, it's another browser. You got link in it's not it's
washington. It's not, you know,
Ah
Johnson Lyndon Johnson and then use
start to read and you understand, I think, that's dead on. I think that you know as you
point his or of monastic egoists. This is both what's up
into the work and also a truly affects the work like. If I moved
the texas, your country to understand the early days of Lyndon Johnson. My book would be about me. Moving to the whole country
to learn about Lyndon Johnson, but he really that eagle business really makes them
listen truly differently. He is not part of the yet journalism movement. He like
no into working that he talked about
Moses, seven times like he kind of hints at it like, as
to the author and noticed call himself the author in his
looks there's something about that and I think that the
the his sword, humility and his role in this as the
person who brings this stuff together get is not the center of the story is
the things that make it so magical
yet, as you say, it's very non.
when he first century, to remove yourself completely from the story. It just doesn't
happen anymore and how many doc
men trees. Have we all seen where the dutch
Miss terry and sorted becomes part of the story. Man that's very much in vogue. Anne and authors are part of it and
our ourselves and our egos
included in that. We get high fives and praise for that. I think what a most remarkable things about the power broker. Is you you about
for five and page, and this and you're thinking hey this
Moses guy is pretty good. He gets
a of stuff done he's
pretty amazing, very talented, a visionary and he just doesn't
put his thumb on the scale in a certain way, even though, when I know I've heard him talk to you and I've heard him speak at Robert caro, he has opinions. You know like
so its interest
as an aid to me that he really puts you in there with the the moment. There is
there are some view from from the few
to show like what has happened or what will happen. That's why? I think
He saw a generous mean. Has this ability just a just war,
divorce himself from that and let the facts resource it was interesting to because you think about in all entertainment, I mean look at movies in one of them
notes.
that any studio would give any screenwriter or anyone.
Making any kind of entertainment today's you gotta? Let us know who the bad guy is right away. Then I mean
we need to know five minutes.
First act of die hard? We need to know that HANS groupers, a bad guy
You need to tell us that, whereas kara was willing to let the whole thing unfold,
and he is running about human beings. So he understands that it's not his job.
You tell us whether someone's good or whether someone's bad he's just going to let it all unfold and as his big favorite thesis, is what,
talk about many times. Is there was
saying that power corrupts absolutely
crops absolutely, and he said well, no power doesn't corrupt in his
in power, reveal sneer and so is,
moses, begins his career and doesn't have the power week. We can't see it yet
but as time goes on and he gets more and more and more power. That's when we start to see really
If things go further and further off the rails and but he's lets, you figure that he has, he doesn't. He has
faith that you, the reader, will see what you need to see.
Once you read it then read Robert caro's work in general. It feels like,
kind of like the freemasons or some sort of a like culture, something like that were set
if someone finds out that you read his work, the various
about it, and they want to talk to you about it. I remember reading the power broke over the first time. You know when I,
the young man you're twenty years ago and being
away in new york reading it and having guys just kind of shuffle up to mingle, ridden the power broker, half enjoy it
enjoy it and then we are going a little. It's basically our fight club. Yes, I'd heard fire dont, yeah yeah, I don't. I don't want to fight you either of you guys, but you know in a
this meant, I mean
sort of do. I think I,
Ok, I'm pretty tall. I work out, but yeah
There is a
yeah, you want to say, fraternal, fraternal order, but I d
think. It's obviously gender based its site were part of its part of this right. You got it now too,
It's like it's like being in the matrix. It's like being the matrix and morpheus shows up and hands you the power broker and is like read this. You understand a lot more and then it's a very different movie cause then you're, just watching Keanu reeves read for hours or for nine months and then as citizens and kc stopping and going whoa
instead of saying I know kung fu, he goes. I know municipal bylaws now and it looks at his hands like did I do that right, I lost all of his enemies. Have just drifted off: they don't even have to fight them. Just like. Are you still reading that? When are we going to know? It's really good? You got it. You got to MR. I understand
still reading MR yeah yeah, I'm actually their building the two miss story.
Going to be leaving? Now, I'm
tiring you're retiring. Yes, I am sixty five. That's the
yeah. That's also the interesting thing about that about that book. Is it it's so comically big yeah
you can't walk around with it in a nonchalant way. They should build up
de beyond its just power broker something it's
aid by a swiss company that just holds a robert carol book.
Against your chest, where I can hear your heart, leaving no failsafe, and you know
it doesnt throw your back out because you can't hold it. You can't say
I'm going hold it with my right hand, because no then you're right, you're right
your body way sixty pounds more than your laughed, so there
could be. I Robert Caro could make a killing if he made a deal with a swiss company.
It makes a little carrier for his books. You know manner,
Is he going to listen to this? Guy was no he's not going to listen to I'm too busy working, I would say heedless. Do it on his walk, but he doesn't use the device on his wall or just thinks about what he's going to write that day. I would love to
room at the end of this process. I am surprised more people don't bug him.
Is like walk into the office. I want to put that out there, but in any case, I think the only people who know that he does it and an art the same people who are like a gallery that next week
I don't want anything to distract him. I don't wanna decide. I just can't take them all the time, because what, if, as he's walking along he's thinking of he's written the last line of the last book, what he is thinking of the last the word sentences that go up to that and then I go up and say: mister
Harold, I'd love to talk to you and he and he forgets what those lessons were any says. Well, you know what to make sure I,
the right idea, I better read every page of Lyndon johnson library again
and then you don't know
was there? Maybe some day the three of us can can meet up and shit.
though kara was he walks through the park on his way to work amazing. Now
it would not be amazing would be wrong. Three men,
rested on central oregon today for stalking america's greatest biographer more a caro stalkers had been caught today.
I know that cairo stalkers been arrested, we got another,
couple of them. Get the patty wagon one patty wagon for just that squad
if you had one sort of like indians speak to the audience kind of like sends of like why they should read the power broker with us this year. What what would you say well
I would say you should read the power broker cause. You will save so much money,
on your satellite or streaming
Are you all you'll be enveloped by this incredible story and by the time you're done reading it really an amazing story about how power works,
and what one person can do,
completely changed the face of an american city, and I'm telling you
its riveting and its powerful, and
When you're done, you realize that
you didn't watch the golden
sure
or any of these other shows utter rob that are robbing you of your life. Assets and you'll have saved some money and symbolic
time and you'll be a better person, perfect thanks for helping us
it really how he had. I'm I'm glad this is labor of love.
I'm so happy to do it happy do chat with you guys
is and I'll be listening. This is this is a cool idea, so I'm on board guys
cause I'm going go was scream scream at people who work for me
not because they did anything wrong, but because I can power broker
it did rub off on you, yeah yeah, the robert Moses yeah. Alright, guys good luck with this. Oh thank you. So much appreciate it. Thank you so much
So there you have it. If you have a copy of the power broker, pull it off the shelf. If you don't put it on your holiday wishlist we're going to spend twice,
Twenty four reading it together and talking about it with some of our favorite people.
These will be extra monthly bonus episodes of ninety nine percent invisible and will cover about a hunter,
pages at the time. Getting
all the way through december of twenty twenty four, the first proper episodes.
on january nineteenth and will cover the introduction plus parts one and two it's up to you. If you want to read it first, if you want to read it after or just
There is no wrong way to be a part of our little pocketbook.
The ninety nine percent. Invisible breakdown of the pound brother is produced by isabel angel factors
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crazy fuck accent couldn't get over the that switzerland thicket.
New york, accents I've ever heard. I've always found it very adorable that his wife is named china and he calls her einer. The sky is
It is an amazing writer he's such a penetrating thinker. He cannot pronounce
his wife's name properly.
Transcript generated on 2023-12-08.