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apple pod guests. Where were you get your pipe gas, I'm thrilled to welcome d on sanders to the university of colorado? When I came in here, I felt the spirit of losing even try to deter ball. Man we're the flushed it immediately the new day. You feel confident blackmail and have been talking to stop audio like that gives way comparable change in the face of college before they might be moving crime uses it now streaming only on prime video. This episode is brought to you by navy federal credit union buying a car is easier with navy federal credit unions, fully loaded, carbine experience, because now you can finance by protect and enjoy your purchase all in one convenient place and with pre approval in seconds great rates and twenty four seven members support you can crews through your next car purchase, learn more at night

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The understand this episode. You should really listen to yesterday's episode and get up to speed, but just in brief the cover what I talked about yesterday, I explained what patents are for and I gave a short explanation of how patents and bad law got started in the united states, keeping in mind the other countries that already had their own patent laws at that time. It's not like the united states invented patent law, and I talked about how in seventeen, ninety the young government of the young united states established patent law, which initially was incredibly strict and then it did a one eighty and became the opposite. I mean like the first year of issuing bans the? U s only granted three patents to and then in seventeen. Ninety three, a big review. Into the law meant that the office was technically supposed to approve any and all patents as long as they had the proper application fee

just from one extreme to the other. I concluded yesterday's episode by talking about the first superintendent of the: u s: patent office, a doctor named william thornton and now we're gonna pick up with his successor, thomas jones. Another position so jones changed hell. Some things worked at the patent office, including a change that carries through to modern patents today that being that he started the specification of the Mention was allowed to reference the accompanying sketches of that invention. It's kind hard to even imagine that there was a time where this wasn't the case where you would have a sketch and or a model, almost definitely a model that probably a sketch too and a set of specifications, but they didn't reference one another that change jones tenure as superintendent. If you read over a modern patent, you'll often see that there will be a sketch. That's

equally labeled, with several parts that are called out like part, a part b, or sometimes their numbered or whatever and then the actual specifications will reference those parts and explain how they work within the grander functionality of the invention. So Jones, like doktor thornton before him, felt that patent applications definitely needed to meet a threshold of usefulness and inventiveness. So both of them had expressed concern that stripping that power away from the patent office meant that folks, with file patents for stuff that was already in existence or that they just plain didn't work. So both jones and thornton ignored that revision to the patent law that the data

back to seventeen. Ninety three that that bit saying hey, you don't have the right to reject patents. They both said you know what I can do. I know the government says I don't, but I disagree with that. So they took a much harder stance on patents that out the are either failed to describe a new invention or were deemed to not meet the threshold of usefulness or both William elliott, who was dr thornton's chief assistant at he, had felt the he should have been promoted to superintendent and he was deeply upset when it's instead went to thomas it's so, he then accused jones of having open to all the mail that was being sent to the patent office himself. Now you might say: well, what's the big deal with that? Why shouldn't the superintendent opened the mail that sent to the patent office while according two elliot his accusation was that sometimes

people would stuff application envelopes with filthy lucre, that is, they would put cash in their application in an effort to greece the wheels, bureaucracy, essentially, they would include a bribe with their application, elliot said that before Thomas jones took over as superintended the patent office headed as a matter of fact that any money that was sent in this way would be returned to sender, and that way you avoid impropriety right, you're, not taking bribes, but since Thomas jones was demanding that he be allowed to open all the male personally. The implication was that he was possibly pocketing this money that he was essentially taking bribes. Now whether that accusation had any merit or not or whether the fact that Jones had a dispute with ellie

because his sons were running a business out of the patent office. One of Elliot sons was a freelance draftsman and was working of the patent office, and so there is the possibility that the Thomas jones was having words with his chief clerk, because he felt it was inappropriate for the clerks sons to be able to run a business out of the patent office. That's not what the patent office four, but I don't know if that's the reason why this all blew up. I do know that ultimately, Thomas jones, I a reassignment. He moved on to work in a different office within the. U s: government, however, William Elliot didn't like get to do a victory lap because he was also told he had to vacate his position, however,

His son was able to retain his his freelance draftsman job at the patent office. That son was named william parker Eliot, so he had William elliot and william parker Eliot and as a draughtsman, he would work with inventors to create the sketches of their invention as part of their patent application, and he would charge the inventors a fee for doing them so that was how he was making his living as part of this process for patents. He'll figure more in our tail as we continue this journey through the history of the patent office, which yell if you read over histories of the patent office, it sounds like it would be the most boring thing in the world right. But, as you read about these interpersonal conflicts, you start to think like. While this is more game of thrones than I expected to be one way, our next superintendent was John d craig. He would serve as the superintendent from eight

in twenty nine to eighteen, thirty, five craig was, let's call him a divisive figure. So, according to historian, kenneth dobbins, Craig was quote arrogant, subject to rages disagreeable to patent applicants and their agents and a domineering tyrant toward the subordinate employees. Of the patent office. End quote so craig inherited in office. There was really short on cash like according to crack, zone calculations. The patent office was short to the tune of around four thousand dollars and keep in mind. This is eighteen, twenty nine he suspected, hanky and or panky had been going on, but he didn't find any evidence of it, like you thought, maybe one of his predecessors, perhaps doktor thornton, had been embezzling money from the patent office, but he couldn't find any evidence supporting that high pop

it's? Not? It's also true that during his tenure when doktor thornton was the first superintendent, he would often request that congress increase funding to the patent office. The congress kind of ignored him for the vote. Part of this would become something of a time honoured tradition for many years. The patent office would argue it data more funding, and no one would seem to care that much at that point. So Craig had a different approach: bending patents than thornton and jones did so. His predecessors had felt like a patent review was a vital part of the process that it really need to happen. Craig felt the most important part was that the applicant paid their application fee.

and if that happened well, then we're good to go it just you know stamp approved on those patent. Applications of the fee comes in so craig wasn't so fussed about patent specifications and rarely, if ever even bothered to read them. According to contemporary reports, he was adhering to that change in patent law, the one that dated all the way back to seventeen ninety three and if any disputes arose due to a patent being say a copy of another invention that had already received a patent or any other problem like that. Well, that was a matter for the courts. There wasn't a matter for the patent office, so he was like nope we're going to follow the law and get all those

fees and not worry whether or not the thing were granting a patent for actually works or if its new. He did, however, find the lack of organization in the office appalling, so he created this system in which he classified inventions according to subject matter, specifically for all the models of the invention, so like models that were designed to do things like farm work would be grouped together that sort of thing, so he did bring a certain kind of organization system to the patent process. Remember at this stage the patents that were being granted and the applications are being submit none of them were being numbered. There was no numbering system with patents at this point so as they were staring amount up in the thousands. getting more and more difficult to keep everything sorted and organised a little bit of foreshadowing. Craig also

sought a sizeable grant for the office for the purposes of constructing a fireproof building into which the patent office would then move because he said you know it be disastrous if there were a few air because we have all these models and stuff. We don't have copies of these patents. It would be a huge loss, oh congress surprisingly actually voted to fund the project, but before that can happen before the building could be built. Craig found himself at the centre of an investigation and employee at the patent office had argued that craig was ill suited for his position and that he should be dismissed from it that employee was The son of William Elliot, also named William elliot william parker elliot why did billy junior take aim at craig

As I mentioned earlier elliot. The younger was a freelance draftsman for the patent office and craig had ended hiring one of his former students. He had been a teacher in the past and one of the students had become a draftsman, so craig hired this former student to come and work of the patent office as essentially another freelance draftsman, but that meant that this student was a competitor to elliot junior and so like his father before him elliot. The second filed a complaint against his boss, and it worked so allegedly present. Andrew Jackson himself signed the dismissal papers in eighteen. Thirty, five and gaiety craig had to

eve as superintendent of the patent office, the elliot's continued in their role as kingmakers or, at the very least as superintendent destroyers, okay, we're going to take a quick break to thank our sponsors and we'll pick up with the next superintendent of the patent office. I I I I I I paper gas listeners returning for season for is the restless ones and original podcast presented by t mobile for business, and I heart radio Join me as I sit down for in depth discussions with the people at the intersection of technology and business learn of there. nick missions and challenges to enhance, optimization and drive their organizations forward. We reveal how two days forward thinking leaders continue to thrive and a world of ever changing technology.

here from those on the leading edge of business, share industry, expertise and how a strong, inflexible network lays the foundation for positive changes in their fields. For revolutions and customer experience and employee enable meant to ideas with the power. to change the game and even the world. They are building a bridge to what's next and adopting transformative technologies like fire, g to create a more connected and meaningful future today check out new, episodes of the restless ones avail. Hold on. I hurt radioactive apple podcast or wherever you listened abad guests. the sheep represents what cats, one cats ones Perfect portions cuts in gravy too convenient servings of roasted chicken covered in savory gravy know what else cats want the red dot from your laser pointer on. Why, on the ceiling on the couch on the floor on a vase,

By sheba, perfect portions cuts in gravy. Zero mess, zero leftovers snapped peel serve shiva what cats one in a world where modern technology is right. badly reshaping our day to day lives. The new podcast technically speaking and intel podcast uncovers the remarkable ways. Tat is improving our livelihood across the globe, brought to you by Ruby studios from my heart media in partnership with intel. Technically speaking, is your passport to the forefront of a eyes ma rolls and modern technology. Each episode will take you on a riveting journey. As you discover the awe inspiring innovations of our modern world from games, changing innovations, revolutionizing early cancer detection to a software that attacks pests on crops that can be detrimental to seasonal yields tune in for commerce issues that are shaping tomorrow today, listen to technically speaking and intel podcast on. I hurt radio app apple, pod guests. Where were you

Your podcast, the guy, is about integrity, he's about character. It's about leading the I'm thrilled to welcome Deion sanders to the university of colorado. When I came in here, I felt the spirit of losing even trying to get through the turnbull merit. We had to flush that a beat,

The prime video sports! This is the biggest experiment that we've ever seen in college football a new day. He always remains really strong in front of all of us. The coaches had many complications: blood clots in his legs. All access see what he's going through make you want to push even harder, no filter when you feel confident black man sitting up and talking to stop. Don't like that. Guy's work about to get comfortable the day. They know regular game is personal. The change in the face of college football fizdale the new season now streaming only on prime video, ok, so J D, gregg is out he's been dismissed from his position as superintendent of the patent office, so who next leads thee that would be James chamberlain picket. What a fantastic name,

He was a veteran of the war of eighteen twelve and he would become the penultimate superintendent for the patent office in february of eighteen, thirty five, but he only stuck around for three months. He was not there. Superintendent for? Very long at all, he actually resigned his position because an opportunity open up in the department of treasury- and he thought that looks like it's better, work for me, so I dont have very much to say about him as leader of the office, because he wasn't around very long in that capacity. But then we get to our final superintendent of the. U s: patent office, a guy named Henry l, ellsworth other great name. He was said to be methodical and meticulous. He the office into shape where there had been chaos, he instituted order and he would serve as superintendent until eighteen, thirty six. But

he remained the leader of the patent office until eighteen, forty five. So how is that possible? How could he be superintendent, till eighteen, thirty, six, but lead the office toiling forty five, while it's because in eighteen? Thirty, six, the? U s government changed its approach to patent law, again. Actually, this time, the government essentially scrapped all existing patent law and started over so once more clerks, at the legal authority to screen patent applications and to deny applications that, were you know, for an obvious invention or a copy of something that already existed or otherwise failed to qualify for a patent since seventeen. Ninety three- they technically Didn'T- have the right to do that. Eighteen, thirty six! They get the right to do it again. The length of protection for a patent expanded I'm fourteen years to twenty one years. At that point now: would change several times

over the years. I'm not gonna go over every single change of patent law that would just be exhausting and and not really that interesting. I will say that that currently, at law, allows for twenty years of protection from the date that the patent is issued, and then you are also able to file for an extension of up to five more years anyway. The eighteen, thirty six act, officially a stab stay patent office as a division of the state department. No longer would there be a superintendent in charge. Instead, the head of the patent office would now hold the title of commissioner, so you might say: well that's a kind of fine point, but it is true that Ellsworth was the last superintendent, but it was also the first commissioner of the patent office because the title changed while he was holding that possess and he took his duties really seriously one of

as was that for all new incoming patterns, the office would assign a number two that patent. Finally, we get to patent numbering where we actually can see the chronological sequence of patents that work granted the very first patent in case your curious pat number one was for a new design for locomotive wheels, as filed by one john ruggles. The changes, the patent law happened in the summer of eighteen, thirty six, but it was the winter of eighteen, thirty, six, where we would see a nother massive change happen to patents. This time, not, because of legislative maneuvers, but because of a disaster. So on December, fifteenth eighteen, thirty that's the worst case scenario for the patent office happened. There was a fire in the paddle

and it was a massive fire that essentially wiped out all the patents, the models and the drafts that had been made since seventeen. Ninety nine, this time, the patent office occupied a section of the blog it hotel, which also had a couple of other tenants and right. You had the u s post office, but I run a key, the other big organization that had a a space bludgeon hotel was a fire department and Steve Martin would say in the documentary roxana we're supposed be putting them out, but seriously the cause of the fire It was due to a really dumb practice that the u s post office workers, were following. I sell at set the scene its december, its washington dc, things can get really cold.

So to keep warm some of the officers had wood burning stoves where you would know. But somewhat in the stove barnett nor to generate heat and keep the office comfortable. So, at the end of the work day, the postal office workers would collect the ashes from there would stove and then they would bring those ashes down into the basement and they would store them in a box at the basement of the blog it hotel and the box was made out of, would- and I think it can probably see where this is going so on that night in december of eighteen pretty six, the ashes that they dumped in this wooden box were still hot, their starts and coals inside those ashes. Those calls all at least set fire to the wooden box. And what, box happened to be right next to the post offices. Supply of firewood in the basement really convenient right, so the fire,

grew and in the we hours of the morning, people began to notice that something was amiss at the bloodshed. Hotel ass for the fire department in had equipment, but it didn't have any firefighters because the firefighter force was a volunteer force and for reasons. I am not aware of. I'd need to look into it further, but apparently earlier there face such a discouraging experience that they disbanded so there no actual fire fighting force in that fire department, so the fire ended up spreading mainly to the areas that were inhabited by the patent office and they destroyed thousands of documents and models and sketches the post office, actually got off pretty lightly. Their document burn a separate section of the bloodshed, hotel and so post office workers were actually able to get in there and rescue important stuff from the post office before the flames could spread. There now

beyond some folks suspected that the fire was actually arson, that someone had that it on purpose, and the reason was that the bless, government was currently in the middle of an investigation into the post office itself thereof. As charges of corruption that were playing out with the u s post office, so rumours began to spread that may be. This was actually an effort to remove evidence by burning it that that someone working at post office. Perhaps a leader, had decided to try and do this in an effort to confound the investigation, but since the actual fire ended up impacting the patent office, but not really the post office. That hypothesis was ultimately rejected

and later investigations showed it was more likely this carelessness and bad practice of storing ashes in a wooden box in the basement than actually led to the fire, not intentional arson. Now, former superintendent crags requests to build a flame resistant patent office really became a top priority. If you were me, where JD craig had while he he had some really come virtual opinions about patents, and I was apparently a terrible boss. He did

We believe that the patent office needed to move into a more fire resistant building, and so he had petitioned congress to fund that and in fact congress did, but it would take a while for that to get built. Mostly old patents that had been stored in the bludgeon hotel were lost, and that would also prompt changes to how the patent office would store buttons and admit that the office would require copies of patents to protect against another catastrophic loss in the future, so that you're not storing the one and only copy of a patent in a single place. It's a bit hard to believe that no one bother with copies up to that point, but I guess till there's a disaster, there's not much incentive to protect yourself. Also, king a copy was not easy,

thing in the world necessarily at at the time. So it could be a pretty time consuming process if you dont have access to the like a printing press or something, and so maybe that was part of it Well, anyway, the office was able to restore around two thousand eight hundred old patents desert aiding them with a number that was preceded by the letter ex this distinguish them from new patents. There were being filed with the office under the eighteen. Thirty six revised wah, so we do have a record of some of the patents between seventeen, ninety and eighteen, thirty, six and that, like I said, they're designated as x and then a number. But again it's just up a fraction of all the patents that were received by the office leading up to eighteen. Thirty, six. I think there was something like more than ten thousand patents total. So you know between a fit

Then a fourth of them survived and all the rest were destroyed by the way the office was actually able to restore patents, mostly by talking to the inventors are patent holders who had filed for the patent in the first place to recreate their initial patent and their sketches and stuff like that they had debt re make them so was unlike. There is just a copy hang around for most of these, it would take for years before the bat novices new digs would actually be ready. Most of the new building was made of stone and marble And it was thought to be far safer than the bloodshed hotel had been, at least with regard to fires and for nearly four decades it served as a decent but not perfect place for the patent office.

As I mentioned, the the early practice with patents was that inventors were to include a model of their invention. If, the bull and models take up a lot of space, so it wasn't a perfect place for the patent office. because there was no such thing as an office that was accepting models, physical models. It took up a lot of space, They would rapidly start to run out of storage space and they would have in our request, things like an extension to the building or something along those lines. So if you review the work of the commissioners who held the office from say eighteen, forty onward to like eighteen, seventy when you see a lot of requests for new construction work, so that they can have more space to store things like models, but things will change in eighteen, seventy seven,

The offers made sure to make copies of stuff with the introduction of photography that included actually making photographs of the models Obviously it's a much harder thing to make a copy of a model that is a copy of a document so photographs largely used as instead of creating a copy. Obviously, if you made a copy of every single model, will now you just doubled the challenge of storing everything, so they would photograph the models rather then ask for a replica of a model they are they. They really change their approach and make sure they had copy stored in different places. So that should something like this happen again. It would not result in as big a disaster as the eighteen, thirty six fire dead in this sense, this up for the second big fire which would happen on september, twenty. Fourth, eighteen: seventy seven were coming up to the anniversary of that major fire of the: u s post office, the set

and major fire before we get into any. Of that must take another quick break to thank our sponsors. Hey podcast listeners returning for season for is the restless ones and original podcast presented by t mobile for business, and I heart. Radio join me. As I sit down for in depth discussions with the people at the intersection of technology and business learn of there, nick missions and challenges to enhance, optimization and drive their organizations forward. We reveal how two days forward thinking, leaders continue to thrive and a world of ever changing technology. Here from those on the leading edge of business, share industry, expertise and how a strong, inflexible network lays the foundation for positive changes in their fields. revolutions and customer experience and employee enable meant to ideas with the power

or to change the game and even the world. They are building a bridge to what's next and adopting transformative technologies like, G to create a more connected and meaningful future today check out new, episodes of the restless ones on the radio web apple podcast or wherever you listened broadcasts. The sheep represents what cats one cats ones. Cuba. Perfect portions cuts in gravy, too convenient servings of roasted chicken covered in savory gravy know what else cats want the? red dot from your laser plainer on. Why, on the ceiling on the couch on the floor on a vase, by Sheba perfect portions cuts in gravy zero mess. Zero leftovers snapped peel serve sheba. What cats one in a world where modern technology is right,

it badly reshaping our day to day lives. The new podcast technically speaking and intel podcast uncovers the remarkable ways. Tec is improving our livelihood across the globe, brought to you by Ruby studios from my heart media in partnership with intel. Technically speaking, is your passport to the forefront of our eyes, our goals and modern technology, each episode will take you on a riveting journey. As you discover the awe inspiring innovations of our modern world from game changing innovations, revolutionizing early cancer detection. To a I software, the detects pests on crops that can be detrimental to seasonal yields, to men for commerce nations that are shaping tomorrow today, listen to technically speaking and intel podcast on iheart radioactive apple pie. Guests, where were you,

at your podcast. The guy is about integrity, he's about character. It's about leading bit, I'm thrilled to welcome Deion sanders to the university of colorado. When I came in here, I felt the spirit of losing even trying to get through the turnbull marriage. We had to flush that a

from crime. Video sports is the biggest experiment that we ve ever seen. A college of all the new day always remains really strong in front of all of us. That countries had many complications, blood clots in his lights, all access see what he's going to make you wanna push even harder, no filter, and you see a competent like me, a bit avanessov audio guys were about to get caught. The boy did they re. No regular gave his person we change in the face of college football. There's no way we might be losing cried. The new season now streaming only online video, ok back, so obviously between eighteen, thirty, six and eighteen. Seventy seven there were a ton of different commissioners who led the patent office. Those them only held the position for like a couple of years at most

but an eighteen. Seventy seven, the commissioner was a guy named Ellis spear. He was a veteran of the civil war on the union side. I should, add, and he had also been a farmer and he was loved classical literature. He had joined the patent office and eighteen sixty five right after the end of the civil war and by eighteen. Seventy seven he found himself promoted to commissioner. And while his time as leader overall has sort of a positive aspect to it: the eighteen seventy seven fire is an obvious exception to that right. It's not that it was his fault, but that was a a big expensive. task trophy. So the fire seemingly started in the room that they were using to store the models. How it got started remains a mystery, so there's various hypotheses suggesting how the fire might

started. A one suggests that some chemicals that were being stored in that room perhaps created really flammable fumes, and maybe there was even a case of spontaneous combustion, which is possible that can happen, others suggested that may be one of the models had like a lens and optical lens that apps focus some sunlight onto a flammable surface in that's holler fired started so essentially like having a magnifying linz position, just right, so that when sunlight is coming through its focused on a point that heats up and then burst into flame. Maybe that's how it happened. Others said that, well, it was probably closer to what happened in eighteen, thirty, six that maybe the it was that the day

was unseasonably chilly because again this happened in september, not in december, and that because it was unseasonably chilly some office workers, you know set a fire in their office like in a in a great in order to keep the heat up of and that this ended up, creating sparks that set the fire, it's hard to say what it was there's, no one really knows, but whatever the cause, the fire quickly engulfed those models among them was a model of Eli whitney, whitney's cotton gin, the only model that was produced for that patent and that was completely destroyed by the fire. the fire claimed far more individual pieces, then the fire that happen in eighteen, thirty, six, because there had been more than forty years of additional patents granted since then. So

while the fire didn't destroyed all building or anything like that, there had been. a lot of patents granted between eighteen, thirty, six and eighteen. Seventy seven. Amid the the pace of innovation, picked up considerably, as the nineteenth century went on all told estimates put the fires tally at Consuming around eighty thousand models and six hundred thousand drawings attached to patent applications, but- and this is a key element- no patents were completely lost, not a single one there. They, there were some partial losses, but nothing was lost completely, so that meant the new processes were protecting those patents that the patent office did not find itself starting from nothing again. The preventive measures actually worked. The copies helped mitigate some of the problems that would follow some back in eighteen, thirty, six,

when all of those patents were destroyed, admit that inventors patent holders and their lawyers were able to argue that no really, they held the rights to a particular invention and because Patents were gone. There is nothing to refer to write, you couldn't go and see like. Oh did you actually file that patent, because the pans didn't exist, so people can make false claims left right and centre with the real claim found themselves fighting for their rights in court, but they lacked the documentation to show the actually had the authority to make that claim, So as a really messy legal situation, a similar thing happened eighteen, seventy seven, but the copies Documentation were able to mitigate that up a bit not totally, but a little bit the monetary costs of the eighteen. Seventy seven fire was by far much greater than

the one that happened in eighteen. Thirty, six, however, the fact that the office lost none of the patents was a huge deal, so one change that ended up being the result of this fire is that the patent office deemed it was no longer necessary for inventors to include a model of their invention with their patent application. So until eighteen, seventy seven that had still been the custom, but the child is of storing and caring for the models had just become too great as more applications reporting in from inventors in the united states. So the pan office would no longer accept models of inventions from eighteen. Seventy seven on that's understand it's also kind of a bummer. It also meant that sometimes it was difficult to determine if a particular invention would work or not with a model. You could at least take

I more educated guess as to whether or not the underlying functions of the invention would work without the model when you're just looking at a two dimensional sketch and then a list of specifications it's a little more challenging, as I mentioned in the show. Pat law has changed a few times since the nineteenth century, but the intent largely remains the same. It's meant to provide protection and incentive for ventures and in return, inventors share their work so that future generations can continue to benefit from their innovation and they build upon it further, and while it doesn't always work out that way and issues like patent trolls can still become a real headache. In general, I think it's been a pretty good idea. Someone should probably patent Now, before I sign off, I wonder mind ya'll that I'm gonna be at this year's. I heart radio, music, festival,

at the house of music. That's happening this weekend on friday and saturday I'll be recording in the eye heart podcast, studio power. the boughs come by on friday at six p m today. The house of music outside t mobile arena. I will see there and you can look out for. episode that I record there next week, it should be live on monday, also to remind you of what the house of music actually is. I can wait to see this in person. I've been reading about it and I'm I'm really intrigue. So it's it's a selection of interactive exhibits and These experiences that are in the house of music or modeled after some of the artists that are performing at the music festival- and they include, but like Kelly, clarkson on one side and public enemy on the other. It is a big spectrum. a boy has a room in their teal sea has a room in there,

not all of them are necessarily mixed. Reality experiences but they're all interactive and their meant to kind of encouraged. The joy of music and the sharing of joy in music. So I am really looking forward to being it for myself and to record in this she'll studio that both has worked with iheart radio to create so again, this friday at sea. P m in LAS vegas nevada, The team of laurina outside the t, mobile arena you'll find the house a music. That's really gonna find me the bald guy talkin about technology, and yet, I hope to see all out there, and I hope your well I'll tell you again releases text is an eye heart radio production for more pod. From my heart radio visit the iheart radio, an apple pie

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