From ethics on Hulu comes MRS America. The highly antics paid a drama that explores the dawn of the nineteen seventies women's rights Movement tune in as explore the story of the equal rights amendments, ratification and the unexpected backlash led by Phyllis flatly that forever shifted the political lands, stirring and award winning cast, including Caitlin shut. Sarah Paulson Loser Duma and Elizabeth Banks, MRS America, new episodes wednesdays exclusively on effects on Hulu visit, Hulu dot com for more. I've got broaden of shoulders to be able to do to whether that they personal changes are my in my career, political or otherwise What I don't have is the cap to ignore my conscience I dont have the cap. City to to say that what was wrong was not wrong. What It really was grievously wrong. It was great the sleigh wrong and yet the president

got away with that good morning and welcome to morning Joe, it is Thursday February Sixth, along with Joe in May, we have MSNBC contributor, MIKE Barnacle Republicans, I d just and Emerson BC political analysts, Susan Del Percy, o cheap national correspondent for the New York Times magazine Mark Leibovitz is with us and former White House Press secretary to. Where are the gangster only getting a little baby? Did they give? It is here and there are no great the ceo leading, really rare, p2p No I'm really was running around the country campaigning for Barack Obama that he was like the fifth Gibbs brother. Have you forgotten about that bed and as Robert sat there and that music came out, I could see the regret wash over his face tat. He had decided to return that long.

Stu Mornings, you're really suture. There's a lot to talk about this morning maker for us here Mitt Romney the courage showed there are quite a few Democrats who showed a great deal of courage to yesterday, three or four in particular will be talking about absolute, who I mean whose political ally we're on the line they chose to do what they believe was right, not what would be popular back in their state, of course, at the president being acquitted, but becomes the first president in the history of this Republic Willie. The first president They have a member of his own party vote too. Remove him from office and why extraordinary day yesterday, ended up being in Washington DC plus oh yeah, there's still county.

EL. It's an eye Joe. I ran into Steve Cornet key in the elevator just now boys. You got a story to tell us. This thing is getting crazy and Bernie Sanders could not only take the popular vote but could edge head here. Also in the delegates we'll get to meet round these historic vote. In a moment I will say a lot to talk about their, but first late developments in I was democratic Caucasus results from Monday nights votes still trickling. Believe it or not. This morning that we are up to ninety seven percent of precincts reporting people to judge and or Bernie Sanders our near. In a tie. Let's bring in national political correspond, the four NBC News and MSNBC Steep Cornet went home slept about forty five minutes. In fact this morning and Manning has posted getting roared stay where we right now yeah. I was here little after midnight and we got a massive change here and I or you can see what it looks like you just put it up there too of one percent, now separating Bernie Sanders in people Let me show you what happened and why there

really is a chance here too, Sanders is going to overtake Buddha judge. The cares this number underneath the twenty six point, two underneath the twenty six, you can read. There are five fifteen for Buddha Judge in a five forties four Bernie Sanders. What this is this is the bit of measurement. Using I ordered the firm in the winter to determine the national convention values. It is called the state delegate equivalent the state delegate, equivalent sort it be so our keen here, but this is very important, because this is how the winner is gonna be decided. The margin right now is for state delegate equivalent. There are not many state, delicate equivalence that are left up for grabs nigh. What the reason why this got so close. The reason why Sanders has a chance is not to do with anything that happened on this map. We ve been showing you for three days. It has to do with member, these the satellite Caucasus, so on hawk is day on Monday, before everybody showed up at night for the regularly scheduled Caucasus

greed, and I were to hold meetings throughout the state for folks who had the work at night for folks who had limit nations that didn't allow them to get to their normal local precinct Caucasus? They had a bunch of them and they put him out by congressional district. There are four congressional districts in ILO, basically for three two one, it looks like this: they wait till this very end to release the results check out. What's happened in three? then we're missing. One result: that's gonna be key check out. What's happening, three of MRS the fourth congressional district. Bernie Sanders got. Seventy five percent PETE Buddha Judge got five percent check out what happened in the third congressional district? This is deploying. This is the biggest one check this out. Sixty nine percent sanders you gotta go we are here to find Buddha judge at one percent What has happened in the second congressional, this This is the I City College, one so more support here for warring, but again fifty three percent for scientists. You gotta go past club, which our past Yang Pass by past and made a very is Theirs PETE Buddha Judge, so you can see,

What this adds up to? Let me can do the math we're here. If you pretend For me, this is my approximation of Iowa, but these are the four congressional districts Sanders gained on due to judge three here in the fourth congressional district well here in the third congressional district five and a half and court five here in the second congressional district, he gained twenty state delegate equivalence from these three Congress, districts. As I said there is one left, the first congressional strict sort of the northeast part of the state were expecting to get that some time today, If, if the pattern we see hole, the pattern we see holding in these other congressional districts, Sir The Buddha judge not registering if that registering if that holds. That is the point. Stability for Bernie Sanders. Net another load of state delegates here? That would put him over the top, and I can do hell yeah, it really is coming now. Do we always

cliche? Is it comes down to turn out the number of state delegates that will be up for grabs in the congressional District satellite caucus pigs on how many turn out to vote. If it is six hundred one or more, it's gonna be worth about eleven state delegate equipped, if it is six hundred or less it's gonna, be worth five point six. If it's eleven either centres, can get over booty, judge statewide and can build up a big enough led right. There There are some outstanding precincts here in Ireland it could come in. Buddha judge could still pick up a little bit here if its, if you get the six hundred. One plus thirty. Ok, I will move to judge could get if it's six hundred of us. It is Today's here for him- and I can just tell you- we some folks out there who are checking these precincts as they come in their best, right now is that number is gonna be around, while six hundred okay. So just to recap, the hits that six o clock

Bernie. Sanders takes the delegates, the delegate, equivalence, which is how we measure winner here, but also already yes, Andrews campaign can claim victory based on the vote total, which is it So we ve seen that this year they made that public. I dont want to jump ahead too far steed, but is it fair to say that these results- we'll be contested either way. Based on what happens in a couple hours. That one outstanding satellite caucus area You could imagine if this thing ends up a real. It's gotta be tight, no matter what you ve, probably seen if your father, when this stuff online for saying hey over here in this precinct. I saw this happen over here in this house and here is a picture of that that's happening? The campaigns have an opportunity to lie, challenges to lodge complaints with a state democratic party? I believe they could do that. Friday, I believe then theirs. Period of forty eight hours that the State Party has to address it? So is the past Billowy there, that where this thing lands there's still a couple more, days, therefore, for looking into it, but you're right, just to put the number up when you say Sanders

the popular vote, this has continued to grow. It is essentially six thousand now on the first preference, the folks who showed up the advance four centres is road of four point, six thousand, and so the question at this point clearly he's gonna finish on top of their. The question is that they delegate equivalent wondering used for the czech marks for the official winner for the National convention delegates. Does he also catch Buddha judge there, and, while that is a barn murderers out. You call it, I guess that's our idea is. Thank you so much Steve jobs. What am I want? My pet peeves less and I began by actually, since this is going on, is people and saying will look at the vote total as well, and so maybe we measured by, Maybe we measured by now. I it's actually that first round sake the first half of a vote our game six hours five b the rules are about delegates. I think at this point it so close. It doesn't really matter both Bernie and PETE. Can

walk away from this as as winners, but it it is here it taking to hear people obsessing or we have so many numbers. We don't know what to do with it. Will you do with it? What you do with the electoral college tallies long, that's, u determines the winner is and that's what candidates, determine a winner, then that's what the winner SL winner is chosen so anyway, it's really not that confusing at all Bernie Sanders Mare paid job Elizabeth WAR knew how they were going to declare a winner in Iowa, we'll find very soon who that winter is by Robert gives a question is: does it matter at this point being Bernie and may repeat, very can be. Entered the losers, Joe Bobby, the winners, Joe Biden, sovereignty admitted he's a loser. I guess Elizabeth Warrant. Maybe she gets a push on new sure is neither a winner, Nora Loser. How does how did the results of via the chaos of Iowa set up?

these candidates going into New Hampshire. What sort of a perfect later on? I was at the vote. Total update at one in the morning creates this sort of chaos at the very last part, but I think you hit on the point pledged delicate, to the convention, are what decide the eventual nominee and I think for both sand, there's an for mere paid. They both the head of essentially the competition most in their layin right sanders as it had a Warren Pizza head of in that sense both of them up, and you see it in the tracking pulling in New Hampshire PETE getting a bump in. And may be creating essentially another two person race, leading Ensue New Hampshire right now and again, I think important that each of those candidates was a head in both the liberal and moderate lanes of this primary aright tactic, look at New Hampshire right here to Roberts point. Bernie Sanders is big time in the lead with PETE. Looking like he's

coming in. Second, at this point, Joe Biden Download, though, and Elizabeth Warren- this is the story, I think, for many years, the limits that without was the boss, the globe, here's Emerson College, one that has Sanders thirty, one percent brutal judge twenty one per Joe Biden Elizabeth, went all the way down of twelve percent, a week. We can take out a lot of headlines from these poles in Iowa. My bites it seems to me to be. We can predict, what's going to happen as we move forward the super Tuesday as it pertains to put a judge and and Sanders but we can declare this that the Joe Biden has ban would met with no doubt the first two full week of this kind did have campaigned the loser he's right. He took a gut punch, Both he and Elizabeth Warren are going to be staggering out of north out of New Hampshire, if these now

as that we say in these. Poles are anywhere close to being accurate, Joseph, The damage there's no doubt about it by Iowa, more specifically by his own campaign, the lack of ground game that he had, and I were the surprise Do you about those numbers that we just put up, though Joe is the slippage the rapid slippage? If you are in Andrews. I was a weaker ten days ago. You would have thought that would be Bernie ahead, Joe Biden Second and Buena judge. Sort of we know well back your item for five points back and Elizabeth just stay in the same, which again Elizabeth swore and slippage has been the prize and in New Hampshire, she was going to win that primary. If the primary were held on things giving day of and she is choose where she is now, but Joe Biden campaign in New Hampshire is now he is it not a must to win, but he is a must finish second or a close third, anything other than that

keys, hurt in South Carolina and it doesn't look at all like he's. Gonna be a close second based on that Paul's ivy suit that five days to see what happens here, but guys the argument from the campaign, the binding, as you know, is lower expectations, and I would do ok in New Hampshire, then we're fine. What we start in South Carolina. But if you finish where it looks like he's, gonna finish in Iowa, and then, if you finish third or fourth down in New Hampshire, the sudden, the voters in South Carolina, which is supposed to be your firewall or looking at you completely differently and that firewall of Africa american voters starts it oh wait a minute. You know it's pretty, we gotta know. Let me take a look at Bernie Sanders of people to judge or somebody who has not had that african american support. You cannot count on out Carolines me a lot for Joe Biden if he does poorly in New Hampshire now make a we talked about several months ago. The possibility that, where's panic among donors. Several months ago the Joe Biden was going to finish forth and I are going to finish for

new Hampshire- was going to be out of money by the time we get through. That we would stagger his way down to South Carolina and hope for the best right now. Right now it's looking like Joe Biden along with Elizabeth WAR. They both have an awful lot to lose in New Hampshire. The only thing I will say: yes, we have to remember and sure make a Robert can remain So this very well. The all of the people hello obituaries that were written about Hillary Clinton in the days leading up to New Hampshire there's no way she could, when I remember even I can. Seventy six George W Bush big, my Ronald Reagan. The press was that he just let me have. It was aren't sorry, nineteen eighty that he was going to get beaten by June George, W Bush that you can go, George W. And eighty eight

losing- and I were coming in third place in Iowa and people writing his political obituary knew. How sure saved him- make the second we tell people what New Hampshire voters are going to do. That's exactly what New Hampshire voters make fools out of everybody. That's absolutely true, and we obviously experience tat, but having said that, Robert gives, I guess, we're gonna, U Elizabeth Warren She doesn't do well in New Hampshire. I'm not sure how she goes on, maybe game that out for me and Joe Biden, White loses all momentum if he fears poorly and the policy too reflecting what we saw in Iowa. Why thing for this war, and this is essentially a home game right she's. Just over the border Massachusetts you get the tv as MIKE. Well knows from Austin into lots of homes in there and I think that question for

in this race is if she doesn't be Bernie Sanders in New Hampshire and she does in Iowa, where in the next three or four places. Does she beat Bernie Sanders had a she overtaken and look, I think, for vice present Biden, it's sort of now or never. I think their recent some strategic. Looking back at the reports that sources were moved out of some other early states into I well, you have to wonder why was given the fourth place finish, but to your point, you ve gotta, make a moment right now. It is time to tear up the schedule. It is time to tear up the the the teleprompter some speeches go out there and speak from the heart, because, if you don't, now to the point of them that Boston Globe, New Hampshire Pole the is, if you see this support dwindling only three days after I was in New Hampshire. What's happened in South Carolina and

if on a wall as we thought that might not exist by the time we get there. It's a it's a long time before South Carolina and I don't know how much money they have sound. Just real, quick jail. I just wonder looking at the Biden showing in Iowa and just the way, things appear to be going he's been many for seven covered by this president during the impeachment trial and in anyway way. It shows how fearful president Tromp was Joe I'd and in others you wonder if some of this stock we can start getting republicans we're a lot more afraid of Joe Biden, then people running in the democratic race at Joe bought. Let listen we I've just sell you personally. We love job Levin and and thought that he was going to do better than he did maybe he ends up winning and moves forward, but this a guy who, despite having the love and respect of a lot of people, ran and eighty eight had had a bad ending to that

campaign ran in two thousand eight, despite winning just about every day debate along with Chris Dodd, still didn't still didn't. They gain traction. There he met just may not be able to gain traction, and these can, asked it's it's really hard to say your bid, but my particle he's got a bigger problem right now about his fire wall. I remember back in two thousand and seven but out lately year. Interim Michelle Obama Iowa, they were still concerned about black vote, is supporting Hillary Clinton instead of Och Obama and then Barack Obama one iota and suddenly louder said: wait a second, this guy just might win. Maybe it's worth the chain. Joe Biden now is going to face the inverse of that, if he loses two races, suddenly these candidates, that black voters in South Carolina weren't looking at that we're going to provide Joe Biden, the firewall. Suddenly

they're going to start looking for other options, a couple of points and Joe one. Sadly, I have to to disagree with you on the impact of what we could just pointed out. I think accurately the Hunter in very small stuff. The Biden, corruption, investigation that has been going on virtually on the other side, maliciously on the other side. I think it is heard him a bit because it's out there is a talking point. People ask you about it, Second point here is New Hampshire is gives you just pointed out the vote are notoriously cranky an independent and Robert was up there. In two thousand and eight when Hillary Clinton went to a pancake breakfast and Claremont New Hampshire and broke down in tears, and that gave every order in New Hampshire. The ability to do something that was almost impossible to do with Hillary Clinton and remained impossible to do access emotionally, that's a lie part of what New Hampshire is about. We believe

New Hampshire for a long time. Looking at that state, looking at the voters, Joe Biden, best shot might be just that. I think going into these final days to access them. What is even more on an emotional level rather than the political level, and Joe Biden can do that. That is something that is actually equipped to do. I think to two roberts point a little of fuel, to go. He he is actually a tear up the script kind of guy. He could actually connect or of an eleventh hour. You know just sort of almost desperation mode in the last few days. In this way. Talking about it is a long time in New Hampshire Mean Bill, Clinton proved it. Hillary Clinton proved it, and at this point I think New Hampshire normally tends to be dependent, but they liked to assert that they are independent, they tend to If I were, they tend to look at poles and they taught tenders, have a real satisfaction, go the other way. So I think Joe

Ireland is in big trouble, especially. We believe these last round of poles the firewall is in danger, but I also think that New Hampshire isn't mode that could surprise and people they liked surprising people. I don't think they like big being disregarded in sort of under the weight of I was they have been over the last few weeks, and this still could be an operative. For Joe Biden, but he's gonna get movement. He did act. Haven't Susan last night, one of those human moments at sea and in town Hall Worry to a motor about its stuttering was it was a nice moment be also on the trail. Yesterday knew him. Sharpen his attacks. He knows it is this kind of do or die time. You went after mayor, you said I gotta respect for Mayor PETE. This guy was the main of a city of a hundred thousand people a couple of minutes ago, Bernie Sanders is a democratic socialist. He calls himself that we share. We want a socialist running against Donald Trump. It was clear to me Esther that Joe Biden his campaign? No, they ve got a move. Now they do, but that's almost the problem with the binding campaign. They chose to go after Sanders and key, so

where, where it, what are you going after? You have fast the binding campaign. From what I hear on the ground, the booty trench campaign has done a great job going after those independence that especially tend to lean Republican who may come out and they can corral them and that will be a huge blow to the binding campaign because they really they never had a great out. First, on the ground in Iowa, and they don't really have a great operation on the ground in New Hampshire. And then what I worry. What I think is going to be. The biggest concern is even if he does very well in South Carolina he's running on almost empty and the money. So you go into for Tuesday you have Bernie with problem close to fifty million Jon, Hamm by then you have Buddha judge with a lot of money, and then you have MIKE Bloomberg, who has countless amount of money, said he's going to be spending there, so I think it's going to be very hard for him to fight that path then, it's impossible, but it's not lining up for him. Some people learn the hard way.

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President trumps impeachment trial ended yesterday, but the vote to acquit was not I partisan, want, as the White House had hoped it was the vote to convict that was by partisan on article one abusive Republican, Mitt Romney crossed party lines with a vote to convict first time in american history of Senator has voted to remove a president of his own party article to obstruct Congress was straight party line, vote, meaning three key Democrats from swing states trumps, one also voted to Caen Doug Jones, who is currently in a tough re election battle back in Alabama. Also, a mansion of West Virginia just in Cinema Of Arizona here is Romney, explaining his decision on the Senate floor yesterday

situation is at the foundation of our republic success and we each strive not to lose sight of our promise to defend it. The constitution establish the vehicle of impeachment that is occupied. Both houses of our kind These many days we have labour faithfully execute our responsibilities to it. We have arrived at different judgments, but I hope we respect each other's good faith. The allegations made in the articles of impeachment are very serious the senator juror. I swore knows before. God to exercise impartial justice I am profoundly religious. My faith is at the heart of who I am.

I take an oath before God as enormously consequential, so the verdict is ours to render under our constitution that people will judge us for how well than faithfully we fulfil our duty. The grave. Question. The constitution task senators to answer is whether the present committed and act so extreme and egregious that it rises to the level of a high crime and misdemeanor. Yes, he did The president asked a foreign government to investigate. Is political rival, the President the president delayed funds for an american ally at war delayed funds for an american ally at war. With russian invaders. The president's purpose was personal and political.

Accordingly, the president is guilty of an appalling abuse of public trust. What he did was not perfect. No, it was a flagrant assault on our electorate, Rights. Our national security and our the metal values. Corruption an election to keep one so in office is perhaps the abusive and destructive violation of one's oath of office that I can imagine. In the last several weeks, I've received numerous calls and texts, many demanded in their words that I stand with the team. I can assure you, That thought has been very much on my mind. You see I support a great deal of what the president has done. I voted with eighty percent of the time, but my Before God to apply,

partial justice required that I put my personal feelings and political biases aside work, to ignore the evidence that has been presented and disregard what I believe my oath and the constitution demands of me for the sake part as an end it would, I fear, expose my character to histories rebuke and the censure of my own conscience I am aware that there are people in my party and in my state who will stretch Strenuously disapprove of my decision and in some I will be vehemently denounced, I'm sure, here abuse from the president and his supporters. Does anyone seriously believe that I would consent to these consequences other than from at an inescapable conviction that my oath, before God demanded of me? I saw

here, too short, to hear testimony from John Bolton Natalie bigger I believed he could add context charges, but all because I hoped that way might say raise reasonable doubt. And thus remove from me. The awful obligation to vote for impeachment like each member of this deliberative body, I love our country. I believe that our Prostitution was inspired by Providence. I've- is that freedom itself is dependent on the strength and vitality of our national character. As it is with each senator, my vote is an act of conviction. We ve come to the fore. Conclusions, fellow senators, but I trust we have all followed the dictates of our conscience. Acknowledge that my verdict will not remove the president from office the results of this set at court, will in fact be appeal. Higher court, the judgment of the american people, voters

make the final decision just as the past Those lawyers have implored my will likely be in the minority in the Senate. But irrespective of these things with my I will tell my children and their children that I did my duty to them to my ability, believing My country expected of me only one name among many, no more, no less. The future generations of Americans who look at the record of this trial. They not merely that I was among the Santa who determine that. What the president did was wrong, grievously wrong, we're all footnotes best in the annals of history. But in the most powerful nation on earth than conceived and liberty and justice. That distinction is for any citizen. Thank you, Mr President. Are you the floor?.

And with that of the White House, trumps kids, the Republican Party just began to snap backlash, against Mitt Romney. The consequences started rolling in almost mediately Mark Leibovitz. You spoke to Mitt Romney right after he made His mind: what did he tell you? Well, he told me what, Do adieu- and I was frankly not surprise, but it was also quite something to hear let make that decision. I talk to him about an hour before I gave that speech couple things me one. He was ass, he seemed Mitt. Romney is known for being just a night's water in his veins kind of guy is doesnt. Not a lot seems to phase him he's very haltingly. He was clearly very emotional around this decision. Hadn't slept much in a long time, and I think that was reflected in this speech itself. The other thing that struck me was just how deeply he had thought about this. I think people,

the very cynical about this. I think that sort of the nature of how people view politics these days, they'll see guinea is a bit performative, but I also think that just sitting there too, get him, there was a real sense, not so much of self justification, but political consequences for him and that he was ok with it. He knew and even anticipated in that speech that the president was coming. He was ok with it. He knew even anticipated in that speech that the president was gonna come right after and his Are you come right after him here what kind of noises is going to make what kind of dust this is going to kick up, and yet he did it anyway and I think he's prepared. I think, like you said, for the judgment of history, for the judgment of faith and eventually did this will subsided. I think he will be remembered more for this, and perhaps anything that he's ever done in his political career that may be losing the presidency in twenty twelve,

I'll make you and I have known, met man for a long time. I've always had such great respect for him. One of the things, though that I've always noticed about a man. It was our personalities of suffering, FR in many ways, but in one particular walk away. He's he's maddeningly, cautious and he especially when, when it comes to politics, he takes for the most part, the safe rout, the cow I did route is who he is just like. I'm the guy that jumped off a cliff and then says I figure out how to make the parrot. On the way down, but here's what so fascinating about the times we live in Other person, who is maddeningly cautious regarding presidential, runs through the ears MIKE Bloom work. Why they're? Both data guys both guys at sit in front of computer screens and look at the data

make the wisest most calculated move any ad in the age of trump they have decided to go hence the eyes, for the first time of their life, to take chances to throw caution to the wind simply but cause an inner voice emits case because of our higher calling because of an oath to guide and that's what's different about, his time said. Yes, we see a lot of people acting worse, but make in this case we see some people actually taking chances, they would have never taken in normal times. Another tat fell. Yesterday, was John TEST, her Who also is in this group, who pushed back, despite perhaps consequences with their constituency, There are, no doubt, might Barnacle PETE Weiner put it best. Some people wrote beautifully

Mitt Romney dead and what have you we're conservatives, lotta people live liberals and Pete waiter said he acted honourably and he acted alone. Think that sums it up very well Joe and your point about the similarities between my Bloomberg Romney. Both data guys, that's how they made so much money in therefore, professions and businesses, gathering data and employing data in terms of corrections but data star at the door of character and conscience, and his always had both. Sometimes not very much on display is he would admit to you. To anyone right now and you as governor of Massachusetts, deals with the speaker of the House a Democrat all the time you didn't like doing it, but he did it, but the

thing yesterday we bow in watching and listening intently. It Romney on the floor, the United States Senate was the impact It is always been there on him, no matter what he was doing, whether it was in business or in politics. On his face. His family and his father. Correct. I think your draw me the three term governor of Michigan in the Sixtys and Seventys Midst, dad ways very heavily on him and has from really the start of his public career? You will recall that during the presidential, opponents and he ran in twenty in two thousand and eight two thousand and twelve- I say that that he would put the word dad on a piece of paper and wood and on a debate lectern before he would go. Do is debates just to remember in the example of his death, and and look he would say now that he didn't always live up to that end. Germany was remembered, I think, more than anything as someone who,

a very unpopular thing inside his party in the sixtys, which is to oppose the Vietnam WAR he got on the wrong side of it. Nixon side of a lot of Republicans in and look it took him a long time to recover and to be should have thought of well by the verdict of history. So what it Romany. I think it took him a while. I think this is a late stage of his career that didn't anticipate having, but I think in some is he had a chance to rewrite the ending of how you'd be remembered and that's part of what he did yesterday. So Susan obviously, was an extraordinary act of political courage given climate wherein by thing it's worth stopping and things why that is an act of Kurds that the frame has so shifted is that all that evidence we saw in the house trial and everything We heard the arguments made by the house managers that, although Other republican senators could turn away and say no that was not an peaceable offence. It shouldn't be

extraordinary shouldn't. Take courage to do what Mitt Romney did it clearly, then he knows the fall out. He knows what's coming. He already saw yesterday immediately the president's son calling for Mitt Romney to be expelled from the republican party. He knows all that he was come more with it any went with it because he said he had an obligation to history, the constitution, to God and to his children, but I do think it's worth stop. In considering why that is now concern extraordinary to consider it your evidence and devote to convict on one of those articles. As Mitt Romney said, he took an oath to do this job and he did it did he was pressure to stay on the team and he said I am on the team. I'm continue. I say he gave a speech that when I was listening to- and I was hoping that it would change PETE some minds up there. It was them inspiring, but what I really was very quickly. Is it won't, and it's not only because of the attacks, the twitter attacks, the president's attacks and everything

It goes on that he was willing to bear. I think the thing that will probably hurt wronged me, the most is the people who knew better and are angry at Republicans, who are angry at me, For being so, principled and making them not look good because they work and they they have been angry at him several times since he came into the Senate, this one it's going to stick with them and that's what's really so sad and unfortunately they can't just admit. Therefore, their failings is that they are angry it right for standing up for what was right. When you know I spoke with somebody close to met yesterday We close to who said that one of his biggest concerns as he he didn't want to put people any worked We have great respect for and who we genuinely like his colleagues, you didn't want to put them in a bad position. Already knew that he had no choice. He had to do what he had to do.

In the end- and so we did it by also for a lot of people, Mitt Romney a win. You ask them how concerned is met is concerned, but at the same time he's only say on the floor of the Senate. What Three other are almost every other Republican is safe. Alone at night about Donald Trump operative. And at night when the cameras- Our turned off and the microphones areaway Mika Ivy Mitt Romney, really is speaking more for Republicans in the Senate. What they truly believe, then Donald Trump. They were just too scared to say it when the lights were turned on in the Senate, when they cameras or on when the microphones could pick up their voice and broad

everything he was saying was so basic and fact based. But for some reason, given that climate, it was stunning d, conservative writer Windsor Man rights. This quote Romney did the unthinkable. He told the truth about a man who never tells it on purpose. At the twenty. Sixteen public and national Convention, TED crews implored Republicans to vote their conscience. That is what Romney dead And what has made him a heretic and his party Romney voted to convict the president. His fellow Republicans voted to convict themselves and Joe mentioned PETE Winner, he writes for the Atlantic, wrote this This also needs to be said. Romney's views are not all that rare among his republican colleagues who know in their hearts that what trumped did was inexcusable and indefensible.

The crossing of a once unthinkable moral and ethical red line had a democratic President done the same would easily have cleared their bar for impeachment and removal from office What is rare, however, is Romney's courage. He acted honourably and he acted alone willing, so Robert gives, you guys obviously ran very hard. The Obama and pain ran very hard against Mitt Romney in two thousand twelve, a lot of progressive yesterday suddenly found there faction in Wiesbaden for Mitt Romney Your reaction, though, if you listen to that speech, will I think you're really struck and in March report your profoundly struck by how he is guided by his faith and how he spoke about that struck by how he is guided by his faith and how he is, look about that and you can just you, can both sea and here the emotion in delivering this speech and understanding the gravity of what he's doing it was

remarkable moment in a play. Gold trial that has not, that many remarkable moments this played out very quickly. It was. It was done with the speed that nobody thought would have and they are at the end. It didn't change the outcome, but it absolutely change the tone. The tenor of what the Senate left with an end, were really struck by who Mitt Romney became yesterday. Hey guys, Willie guys here this week on the Sunday sit down. Podcast music, superstar, Cheryl Crow, her journey from a small town in Missouri to the top of the music world, get the podcast now for free wherever you download yours.

Welcome back the morning Joe, it is forty nine pass the hour joining us now, president of the council, on foreign relations and author of the book of world in disarray, Richard House also with US editor and The economist sentiment in better is great to have you both with us to smoke. Richard last let let's talk about the present state of the union address and specifically for and policy. Let's talk about what he said. I guess warm. Fourthly, what he did not say your take bodies. Was he did a victory lap, a raw isis trade. Didn't say, though, is really interesting. One was any other aspect of U S. China relations was essentially ignored. North Korea, which figure pro currently Joe a year ago in the state of the union was not uttered this time around. He talked about trees, but never to about climate change, which was

another measure, and then Russia, Ukraine, lest I check that there is still a war going on there should. This was a very selective the world inside the stick. The state of the union, but the most interesting thing might have been going forward was also what one thing he did mention, which was Afghanistan and if I were an age maker, I would think the odds that year, she further troop reductions unconditionally out of Afghanistan. I think the president wants to go into the election with a talking point, only did he get american forces out of the Middle EAST, but he did also american forces out of Afghanistan driven by the same instinct. Barack Obama had getting forces out of Iraq quickly. For his re election campaign that didn't actually turn out very well. Let's talk about the Middle EAST Peace Plan, Richard It was talked about a week ago. The present at a press conference of Benjamin Netanyahu is any chance that any part of this peace plan will ever be implemented.

But not as a peace plan and not as a negotiation? I think the danger is that chunks of it could be implemented unilaterally by Israel, so it doesn't become a peace plan. It becomes a real lady. That's the danger and already were beginning to see signs of pushed back. If you read our it's this morning, what was straight, into me in January. We're talking about it was how flashpoint suddenly are beginning to emerge. You have cars running over soldiers in Jerusalem, three per stands killed and in the West Bank, Israel going down into Syria to attack the missile sites, their Israel going into Gaza to attack us that again, you ve got this code on coal plants coming out of Washington, which bears no relationship to the challenges in the region, but the come back to where you began. No, this is a political plan. It is not a peace plan, then? The economist says it cover on the corona virus? How bad is it it's pretty bad, it's

hey Man in China, and I think the big question is you know a how far and go beyond China and be what is the impact of what is happening in China, and I think, in both cases I pretty struck when the we care in the? U S, how little attention is being focused on how the markets that kind of shrugging this off now, I really don't know yet. I think the prism through which many people are looking at this is the prison of saws, which you know was the virus that hit China and that part of the world in two thousand to two thousand three, very different now just to give you a couple of numbers in China much more connected to the world, the falling back, banning flights. Two hundred thousand people left cheek came into China by air every day, as a footstool number of well it's also a sixteen percent of the world economy compared to four percent, then so I think nothing much more a fact, and I also think we are far from seeing speaking in China and all of these factors- closed after the new year for a week, or so this could be several weeks and if so

weeks or even a couple of months. The hit in the world economy is very pretty hot and people going to start getting worried petition. If it spread a lot more outside China and richer part of that concern, as you pointed out, is that people are sure what to believe in terms of numbers that come out of China does not have a record exactly being completely transparent, giving I assume that the number of people who see their habit or probably will come down with it. What the numbers being put out a way way way low when it could be a factor of ten, could be a factor of twenty five in which in far larger second, what what the biggest question is. Literally a lot of people can come down with it. The real question is: how severe is it, insufficient it easily bill. Is it because the viruses that leap or is it the lack of access to adequate high duration to mass? What have you so? since we don't know the other thing, I would say we don't know everything about the disease, about the economic advantage spot on it's gonna be more disruptive. Supply chains is the political head in China. The most.

Kristen conversation to me is what implications will this have persuasion paying? What would this due for the Communist party? You can't consolidate power, the way and then suddenly say not on my watch. This is on his watch like it or not. Clearly they very sluggish, and I think that would be really interesting and also what does it do to the China relationship with the rest of the world, as I think this could well view will assign a phobia than is rising. Sat me in this country and if you have people pour out foreigners from from China, and you have For several weeks, a couple of months, you're gonna see people really waiting worrying about what's happening in China and kind of standing back from that. So I think, there's a lot more to come, and finally, Richard extraordinary moment among many during the soothing need address, was the venezuelan opposition leader in the room in the gallery president, pointing to him and then inviting him for a visit at the White House promise. We don't have a plan here.

They are in the gallery, is in the gallery, he's not and then as well are. Meanwhile, you have the majority government stronger at the New York Times during a very interesting story. A couple of days ago we did. The regime is a beginning. Loosened up selectively, there's a degree support for the regime from a particular the upper classes. So we can support Meanwhile, you ve got what four million refugees overwhelming the neighborhood, and I don't see a way where MR guided goes from the gallery of the? U Congress into the streets and have real our inside Venezuela that's right and he's not gonna do much. Ruins well is sitting in the gallery in Congress. It's a year ago, that was more, like the longer it's gone on the harder. It is to see that so it's one of those things that good photo up in, and they say, but I'm not sure, is really doing much later

maintain Betters Richard House. Thank you both for being on this morning, going around the world with us since to pay its crusades this week in my pocket, wise is happening all be talking with computational biologist, Carl Bird Strong, but what we do and don't know about the corona virus once they, things get out there, and this is kind of sort of a key aspect of misinformation, and this information is the once they're out there. They really take off and they spread, and so Jonathan Swift said several hundred years ago, that switch flies and truth comes limping after and and that's what happens on the internet, of course, that there is a more recent version. Which is known as Brando in his book. They cemetery principle, and it says the amount of work that it takes to clean up both does an order of magnitude larger than the amount of work it takes to create it so we definitely see that sort of thing happening with all kinds of conspiracy theories, including this one around the virus that this week on. Why is this happening? Search for? Why is this happening wherever you're listening right now and subscribe